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Hi All I have been following the interesting threads here since recently joining, and I thought I would say hi to introduce myself. I have a chequered car history, and in the early day's lot of experience of driving 'sheds' over the years (I can laugh now!) Definitely, the worst was a Peugeot estate previously owned by a farmer to transport his sheep. The dented exterior complemented by the very natural smelling interior, and the sticker "Put British Pork On Your fork" which used to make our friends laugh at the vegetarian driving it. How could I forget my gold Metro held together by welding upon welding but driven until it died a natural death. Then came the mint green Toyota Corolla (named Trebor) although I have to admit I did actually quite like this one. However, I used to dread it when my (now husband) would say to me "I found us a new car" I have also had many experiences, as you might expect given the above, of riding with rescue vehicles. I remember vividly a very long trip home to London from Wales travelling in the cab with a newborn and a two-year-old. I really know how to have fun! Now I opt for safe, comfortable, and reliable. For the last seven years, we've owned a 2008 Mercedes E220 ( it just keeps going!) to transport our three animals, sorry, I meant kids around . In fact, after one snack filled trip in the family car, the Peugeot was probably cleaner! I dream of the day I will buy myself a Maserati Quattroporte, although I'm not sure if that ticks the reliable box! I look forward to learning from all of you experts and will help all I can to answer any questions you have on buying and selling cars using Facebook and Instagram. From what I have seen, in general, there does not seem to be a lot of love for Autotrader. Do you see a day where you don't have to use Autotrader?

Hi All Im fairly new to this so not sure if this is the right place to post but we are considering launching a new platform for car dealers all over the UK. The question is what do you actually want and how much are you willing to pay for it? There has been a lot of negative feedback about the price of Auto Trader etc... but what is it you guys actual want/ need ? No point re-inventing the wheel or creating something now one is interested in so to cut through all the BS.. What do you want (in as much detail as you can) How much do you want to pay (A number please)

Just posted this in the IMDA , Officially price increase on 1st April , Letters /emails in the post, not got mine but I asked yesterday. Approx cost rise is £4.50/5.00 per car -per month ! Nice .. Just think 436776 cars showing this morning .. say 350,000 are dealers cars at £4.50 per car ..you do the sums !! £££££ Finance Calculator is chargeable from 1st April ( As I've previously mentioned it has NOT generated any deals for me since September 2016 !! ) but if you read all their posts/blurb its the best thing since sliced bread. As you've probably guessed it, IF you don't pay for the finance calc and customers search by monthly payments your CARS WILL NOT SHOW ( Just like PX Tool didn't ) as it can't work the payments without the chargeable calculator, the option they are offering is to have a FREE One but it's from ZUTO ! ( told them I'll be having Zuto but many of my images , now we have 100 will be saying finance ONLY Through ourselves and not Zuto, which they say it's up to me if that's what I wish to do!! Cost of their calculator for my stock circa £70 per month. Now the good bit .. The stock display will be better and the profile page for each dealer will also be better ! ( So they say!) AND How's about this for a 'U' Turn, FREE, Yes FREE Feed export to anyone from dealer portal. ( I said there is only one reason for this, they have lost so much business to the likes of Click dealer etc because of charging for stock feeds that they are trying to gain business back with AT websites, I also said they are also seeing which dealer feeds to where , why would ANY Dealer want to give them that information? Their argument - we're helping dealers !)

Hi everyone, just to let you all know this may be a bit of a long post, but I hope you appreciate the extent I feel I should go to address this topic. I've been lurking around a little on here the past couple of weeks after seeing Autotrader's profit margin and deciding to learn a little more how the dealer world works. From going through the forum I can see this question comes up a lot, many people here are really not a fan of Autotrader's fees, but the competitors are struggling to disrupt them. Some have given it a fair try, one 'nxtcar' even posting on here looking for feedback a while ago, but these new entrants evidently didn't get going. As some context I'm a software developer, coming to the end of a project for a client in the next couple of weeks. I have been looking for a while for something to work on myself after this project is completed, but would like to target a market that is a bit of a challenge, and ideally one that has an opportunity for disruption (which judging by the frustration of many dealers on here, this is one). I'd like to lay out my assumptions as to why competitors like carguru and motors have failed to disrupt AT to a significant degree, and the way I would approach this. I would be very grateful for your advice as a community, and your personal opinions on whether this would be something you believe I should try to get running. - The problem with competitors The overbearing problem in competitors I see is that they are too broad. Almost all of the competitor sites that have popped up have come with the mentality 'dealers don't like how expensive AT is - I'll just make AT but cheaper'. This is the first mistake. Most of how i would build the site revolves around what is called a disruptive innovation model, I did initially include a picture but it posted far too big and detracted from the text. Almost all startups that disrupt an entrenched competitor (particularly a marketplace) follow this model. In simple terms it states a new entrant must segregate the market they intend to disrupt, focusing first on a niche, low profitability area and getting that right before expanding.The monopolist (Autotrader) naturally over time will overshoot the requirements of middle and low-end customers in chase of higher profits, failing to keep them on-side and leaving an entrance for new competitors. Autotrader have done this already, the constant price increases on dealers who are their raison d-etre has squeezed the community, and many would say there is growing disconnect between AT and dealers. Potential competitors to AT have completely ignored this model, instead trying to combat AT as a whole on a very broad scale - a model I feel is doomed to fail. If you asked people on the street where to buy a used car, I guarantee 90% of them will say autotrader. Almost none will say carguru, motors, 'insert competitor here...' etc. The reason for this is is AT has been around for a while, and was pretty much the first mover in the online used car market. It is much easier to form a new habit in someone's mind (used cars = autotrader) than to change an existing one, especially if your site/product is effectively the same. You can spend multiple times more on ads than AT but the damage is already done, there must be something other than higher ad spend to differentiate yourself (I'm looking at you carguru) To challenge such strong, broad network effects you *must* start niche, ask any one of the swathes of companies that have disrupted craigslist which is the same model I would follow. So it should come as no surprise the competitors don't do well. *An added point here is some competitors have tried to offer a better consumer service by showing info such as price changes, how long a car has been listed etc. These tactics I do not believe benefit dealers and are putting the 'demand' side of the marketplace first, when it should be the other way round. A very similar market to this is property, where rightmove is the incumbent and zoopla is disrupting. Zoopla have done well without helping one side at the expense of the other by offering third party services (crime maps, mortgage calculator etc, estate agent software) Autotrader begun by only making money when they made you guys do well, you were a team. Now however, especially with the steady rise of private sellers, believe me when I say AT would throw you all under the bus if it meant more profit. They have forgotten why they exist. AT can charge individual private sellers a higher amount for single car listings, and a move to more private sellers and less dealers benefits them. -My approach Not surprisingly I would start by segmenting the used car market. It appears a minority of cars are <£3000 (many people seem to also struggle with where to advertise low value cars, Facebook, Gumtree etc) and I'm sure a minority of buyers are young first time buyers. My initial target would be lower cost cars, with a site designed for first time buyers (potentially targeting a single area like london/manchester first too). Here are the reasons this would be my target: This price point is full of time-wasters, people haggling, no repliers etc. Introducing just a few steps such as personal emails only (no auto generated emails like carguru), prompt towards ringing dealers rather than messaging (people who aren't serious don't tend to ring as much) etc will hopefully help what is a general problem for dealers anyway, and I'm sure most here would value quality over quantity. Can also flag people to dealers who make appointments but don't show etc. Appreciate your thoughts here. Channels for marketing are much easier and cost effective. b2b marketing is easier than b2c, and this opens up marketing through driving instructors and the like (who's clients may be looking at buying a used car soon and are obviously first time buyers) and finding first time buyers is easier than marketing to the general population. This will help restrict necessary ad spend and enable a very low cost launch, ideally free for dealers to list and I can absorb the small running cost initially. Allows avenues for offering a unique service. We can build a more specialised marketplace when targeting this demographic than the general population, we can make a 'first time buyers guide' forefront etc, have advice columns on what to look for when buying your first car, finding first time driver insurance etc. Again your ideas appreciated. Partnerships. There are plenty of insurers who specialise in first time drivers, they understand the value of stickiness. If someone uses them the first time they're highly likely to stick with them later. If we have an audience of first time buyers, I feel an enormous amount of leverage could rest on us negotiating a discount with an insurer as long as people use our site. E.g. 10% off first 6 months at adrian flux when you contact and buy a car from a dealer through us. Even if we're not the first thought for these people, that's a big value proposition, and word like that spreads fast. Finally, product stickiness. If people use our product they're highly likely to come back. First time buyers will never have used AT or anyone else before, which enables us to form a relationship with them first. I feel this rests almost entirely on negotiating a discount with an insurer which could make this or break it. I would appreciate all your thoughts on all this, and if you believe in my approach. If it seems there is a positive feeling, my first port of call would be to gather emails/signatures from dealers proving intent to use this product if it was built. I would then make contact with insurers specialising in young peoples insurance to negotiate a discount which I feel would be such a vital part of this, and they will take it more seriously if there are a few hundred dealers already in support. I am also more than happy to have phone calls with individuals to share your thoughts/discuss the market and idea which is always helpful, and far easier than typing all this out! Therefore feel free to PM me if you want to chat. Let me know what you think!

Value markers on AT / Car Gurus This could be controversial but just curious to see what everyone thinks, value markers I believe are misleading but that’s for another day! Some of you price cars on these platforms to get the markers BUT if the markers say ‘below market value’ surely these dealers are giving away ‘profit’ why sell below market value (of Couse we don’t always know the full story of each car hence I disagree with the markers) we’ve all seen cars sometime thousands ‘below market value’!

Happy new year! I seem to be hearing a lot of people leaving autotrader, we have 80 vehicles in stock and are paying around £4.5k + VAT every month! Autotrader does bring in enquiries but not enough to warrant spending £5k every month! What are the alternatives?

Hi all I'm wondering if any one has any information on any of the best deals for listing motors at the moment?? Are any providers listing sales or discounts on their listing fees? I'd be interested in Autotrader, Gumtree/eBay, Car Guru, Motors.co.uk and any others that you think are value for money... Cheers

Strange situation I tripped across couple of days ago and just want to make sure you are not affected ! I check on & off on Autotrader to make sure ALL my cars are advertised and if they look OK etc etc … Spotted couple of days ago only 28 Advertised from 38 … spoke to my account manager who’s currently still checking whats wrong .. resent all the cars back live on dealer portal over night feed all cars OK – Morning feeds somehow deletes some of the stock .. this morning 32 advertised out of 38 …. Issue still not resolved – Technical dept looking into it but as I’ve explained to my account manager – doesn’t help me as cars not being advertised ! So- guys and girls just keep an eye on it , this may just be an isolated case ! Better to check !

Google, the monster that dictates everything digital in the world has been fined £2.1bn due to unfair practices. Does this draw a comparison to what AutoTrader do? In this months Car Dealer magazine ( AT advert/feature) , Marc Thornbourgh of Autotrader compares what they have done with 'Sponsored adverts first default' or what they call 'promoted' to how Google advertise their 'Sponsored Adverts' first. In fact I think with AT it's actually worse because of where they place the drop down box on the screen at the top right hand corner , the least likely place for a potential customer to look, at least Google tell you(even if it small writing) that's its a sponsored ad. Your thoughts? Do you think that AT are ever so slightly kicking themselves with their comparisons to Google? Jim

A good friend sent me this over the weekend , some may have seen it but just in case you missed it .... Sadly it won't me post the image !! [ Any reason why James why we can't have images ? ] ..I've posted this on other forums if you wish to have a read !

I really, really hate these with a passion ! Why will Autotrader not listen .. We do not need 'price indicators' , without rambling on these are genuinely misleading the innocent public and will affect every dealer who advertises on Autotarder - Including ME !! Going live 4th April , initially on mobile only then I guess being rolled our everywhere.. ( Won't allow me me to upload image )

Car Values ! That old chestnut ! We all use various guides to value car s/ buy car s/sell cars ..but everyday its gets more and more challenging on not only what to buy m what to pay and then what to retail it for to make a workable margin. Find myself today question WHO is is really giving a TRUE VALUE of a car. Golf TDI BMT Match 5dr - 2015-15 -14000 miles VALUES AS Follows GG Trade £11970 Retail £13510 CAP Clean £12000 Retail £13695 Autotrader Retail £13759 In reality they are all very similar , a lot closer than many other cars I've checked On AT Prices start at £12395 / Loads at £12500 12/14000 miles - one owner On motors prices from £11999 with 17000 miles - One owner The low prices are mainly from car supermarkets / bid group - so does this mean they dictate what the retail market is ? I'm told auction prices are fetching cap clean + , don't forget the commission , transport etc etc , so how do we the independents compete ? As we all know customers who search these platforms will naturally do the ' price' checks but if they are selling at £1500/2000 less than the 'suggested' market price , surely these customers will travel and buy them ? ( I'm sure they will end up paying more with the bolt on's any way !) I'm sure the manufacturers of some these cars must be getting worried a Golf to depreciate circa 45% ?? ( 21500 new - trade circa 12000) ! Thoughts ?

We all these leads , lets see how YOU would respond to this enquiry ..in time I'll Let you know how I replied and what happened ! "Name Bob Thomson Message whilst car looks very attractive appears overpriced for year. what would be your best cash price if i travel to view car" This is the car : http://www.specialistcars-stoke.co.uk/listing/peugeot-207-cc-gt-coupe-convertible/ Umesh

Valuations Sure this topic has been brought up previously and no doubt it will be raised again BMW 1 Series SE Auto 3dr- £4040 factory options 21800 miles 2013/13. White / Black leather with £4040 factory options We all use various valuation tools , so I try to check its value on Autotrade-mail £14819 Glass's guide £14200 ( Strange as when Glass's DM and checked it came back at £13530) Cap Clean £12100 ( £11500 Average ) Now before I reveal what I THINK the market value is for this car I'd love to get your opinions ( Needs 2 wheel rufurbs thats all ) . What's Trade & Retail IF you were buying this for stock. Join in - don't be shy :).. After all no one is right or wrong - just look at the difference in opinions , or is it data ?

Just in case some of you missed the interview on TradeplatesTV with Stefan Voloseniuc CEO , Stuart Askey of Autovolo , Jim Reid - all explaining how the '1000 voices' concept will work ! http://tradeplates.tv/live/live-6pm-autovolo-jim-reid-vehicle-sales/ Who's IN? Your Thoughts? Umesh

So. A little teaser for you: I have a regular, good spec, 1 year-old, 11k miles, white, City car in stock. Nice little thing, should have no issues selling it. But I thought i'd have a little mess around with the online selling price, just to see if and how the stats could be manipulated and, therefore, trusted (or not...) We're told endlessly how we have to make sure it's absolutely in line with the Market Price as decided by AutoTrader's Log of Rhythms, or whatever, as the better the price, the more chance of a sale... So I priced it up at the figure suggested (£8000) and achieved, over time, a daily average of 144 Search appearances and just 2 advert views. "This is not so good," I thought to myself, So, I changed a couple of things and have now had the car advertised without pictures at a different price and have generated a daily average of 2608 Search Appearances and 23 Advert views. 'Vs similar ads' my Search Appearances for this car are now +1007% and it's in the green for Ad views at +512% (apologies if you don't have AT Dealer Portal stats, but this is, apparently, a good thing). And it's sold. So, the question is as per the title: How much did I advertise it for to generate such high viewing figures?

Today the 9th of June 2016 Autotrader in the UK announced a staggering profit of £169M that's up £36M year on year, yet more price increases on the horizon for car dealers. http://www.iii.co.uk/research/LSE:AUTO/news/item/1990963/final-results?context=LSE:AUTO So are you happy feeding this monster? If not, why not join me and fellow dealers on a journey you will never forget email me on ayecontrol@gmail.com to show your support for change. As a dealer I'm sure you set up in business so you had 'control' of your own destiny, that 'control' has now left. So join the 'ayes' to the RIGHT ayecontrol@gmail.com and lets get BACK 'control' it's YOUR FUTURE. Jim Reid

what's on their shopping list? http://www.digitallook.com/news/news-and-announcements/auto-trader-directors-and-managers-sell-60m-worth-of-shares--1106269.html how do you explain this one to your customers and does your buyers fee cover you for this? http://www.examiner.co.uk/news/west-yorkshire-news/car-transporter-fire-causes-hold-11217891 and finally Bethany how big is the sign on the wall saying THEY NEED US MORE THAN WE NEED THEM. Does it exist and has anyone seen it and got proof?

Do any of you feel that it is wrong that AT will not allow you to upload stock directly from your own private website (Independently hosted) to your AT account? In the USA you can install an API to upload stock form your own website to your AT account. Seems here in the UK they want to force dealers to use their website offering.

A number of dealers have joined forces to try and tackle the never ending Autotrader increases, what we can do , we are not sure yet? If you would like to join the group come here - www.dealersmutual.co.uk Currently we are gathering dealers to discuss how we move forward....

So we’re in the final week of February, Talking to lots and lots of dealers it’s been a tough month for leads, sales, profit (According to the majority!) So who, what do we blame – the climate, the stock, the advertising platforms i.e. Autotrader, Motors, eBay, Piston heads, local press, Google, Gumtree ,sales staff (for those who have staff!) or ourselves or maybe the weather – whatever we all blame it doesn’t change the fact we’re all not happy with the results. Sometimes I guess we need to look at what we are offering to our customers , I’m no marketing guru but I try and put myself into the customers shoes , IF I was looking for a car searched the net from where ever and eventually landed at the dealer website what do I want to see. Well believe me it’s shocking, dealers trying to sell cars with poor images , quality and quantity , dirty floor mats in the foot well, dirty cars, stains on the seats, flat tyre ( Oh Yes!) and the list continues .. Would YOU even bother to call or visit that dealer? NO! Then why do these dealers expect the customer to even call never mind visit or buy the car. Back to basics! Preparation and presentation has to be 1st surely? Now I probably go overboard with the number of images between 25/60 ! and a Full HD Video walk around of every car..But It SELLS CARS ! Only last night a customer collected a Galaxy and he told me about his experience, his words “ You would not believe the state of some of the cars I've seen , some dealers have 2/3 pictures and not even been valeted , when I saw the video of your car I knew you had nothing to hide , and that made me buy the car – I've not seen anyone else do that , think it’s a fantastic idea†I've sold quite a number of cars simply down to the video ( Now I should keep that secret to myself) In all honesty if it helps some of you guys sell more cars – fantastic ! Some of you may think waste of time and don’t have time to do them, that’s fine , some may be saying I sell loads without doing all these ..great continue with what works for you. Please feel free to check out my website and video’s AND Please shout if you think i could improve on anything – all feedback appreciated – positive or negative ! Happy Selling guys and remember keep smiling and enjoying what you do , most of all have FUN ! www.autochange.co.uk

Not sure who’s seen this video by Marc Thornborough – Brand Director AutotraderI think its a great video and insight to what Marc and his team are doing back at base https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIldk77jpDs Its just over 6 minutes and well worth watching !Would be great to get some feedback , and did you know what exactly went on at AT – HQ?

I’ll throw this in and lets see what you guys think ! In reality ALL WE want is to advertise our cars for the cheapest method and get the best return /sales , but business constraints / open market /return on investment etc etc all dictate what can be done for what price. Also in reality WE Know Autotrader cannot bring down prices , So what can they do to make us all happy ! or how can they help us all ? magic wand – ideal situation- Fire away and lets see what ideas we can throw in , and just ,maybe just we can gain something from us all…. Thoughts Guys ?

Can someone please confirm I am not seeing things, I have just logged into our email system and the last email received at exactly 11am is from Autotrader - pushing their latest 'webinar' promoting the importance of Price Transparency!! Are they taking the yellow stuff or what??

It's almost 3 years since we stopped advertising with Autotrader and although 'they' (the doubter said we would not survive without them) , here we are not only surviving but thriving without the burden of the Autotrader invoices that everyone and their dog moans about! (especially the 5 week months) So I have decided to share with you all, via a Podcast interview with Derek Blair from www.cardealerpodcast.co.uk how we achieve sales through Facebook. Click here to listen or download their APP via iTunes http://bit.ly/1iEEFtX IT ONLY WORKS! Not only does it bring thefun back into selling, it sells cars and the saves money on advertising too! Find out how we have managed...... Any questions feel free to shout! Jim