Should dealers be selling - and crucially - delivering cars during lockdown?

[James Baggott 227]

The industry is split on this - selling cars, and whether you can deliver them during the lockdown.

As Cazoo restarted sales and deliveries this week, it was met with some shock and anger from others.

Here's my Sunday read for you on the topic...

https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/car-dealers-selling-delivering-cars-lockdown/190334  

Let me know what you think as always

[Casper 272]

Guess it really depends what people think are crucial for example if an nhs worker or other key-workers cars has be written off stolen failed mot well should say developed fault that would cause a failure due to the extension etc or they have been using public transport then I can see an argument for it .but can also see the argument against if even those type of workers just fancy a change . 

The more worrying concern is with a lot of main dealers been closed and some only open for essential work with lower staff numbers for key workers whats the waiting time going to be .currently know of a golf with broken seat adjustment and a vivaro with the alarm going off when locked neither really an emergency just now  but what if something major happened to a lease car of an nhs worker many in our area are leased through companies that are closed how long would it take to get a repair or courtesy vehicle / hire car to them.   

Edited April 19, 2020 by Casper

[Mojo121 229]

I’m seeing too much conjecture and vilification of others when legally we can deliver a car from an online order, there’s a specific allowance in the legislation under section 51a to do so. Whether you choose to is just that: your personal choice how you run your business, it doesn’t make you some virtuous saviour of mankind if you choose not to either.

We should familiarise ourselves with the rules of the game if we want to play.

[XFS 70]

24 minutes ago, Mojo121 said:

I’m seeing too much conjecture and vilification of others when legally we can deliver a car from an online order, there’s a specific allowance in the legislation under section 51a to do so. Whether you choose to is just that: your personal choice how you run your business, it doesn’t make you some virtuous saviour of mankind if you choose not to either.

We should familiarise ourselves with the rules of the game if we want to play.

I think this is a good post on the subject and in in line with my views.

Personally, I am choosing not to trade on any level during the lockdown, this is my choice based on the safety of myself and my partner as much as anything else.

But I am not going to criticise those who continue to trade legally within the guidelines. Equally, that is their choice.

[metcars 397]

But we shouldn’t have to decide if and when it’s safe to return to work? That’s what the government are for? They should be telling us when it’s safe to do so! 

I’ve decided not to be critical of those who feel they need to break the lockdown. If I was a young single guy with nothing to lose I’d probably be out there. But I’m a 58yr old guy with heart failure and hypertension and according to the letter from NHS am extremely vulnerable and need to stay home for 3 months! Personally I cannot afford to catch it, and I am certainly not prepared to ignore the advice of hugely intelligent medical professionals just to play Russian roulette with my life over a shitty 10yr old focus!

Oh and a nIcely written article James

Edited April 19, 2020 by metcars

[BHM 994]

Cazoo would counter that by saying what they are doing is no different to that Amazon delivery driver dropping off parcels.

Tbh I struggle to disagree with this point of view. Half of the restrictions are bollocks due to the weak implementation of controls.

The govt would of been better operating like a Communist state, instructed everyone to stay at home & enforced it with public floggings but I guess they don’t have the legal powers so we ended up with scenes such as those in London parks sunning themselves rubbing suntan lotion into each other’s backs.

Anyone who thinks being 2mtrs from an infected person in a supermarket queue who is coughing & spluttering is going to be saved is misguided.

I’ve spoken to one of the many taxi drivers working & he was allegedly advised by a medical professional to keep passengers in the rear, keep HIS window down & regularly use sanitizer on the handles & the controls he regularly handles.

I’ve done a couple of contactless sales to very local customers but think if we all hang on a few weeks we’ll get further guidance from the govt. Personally I think I’m at much higher risk walking around a supermarket.

[James Baggott 227]

I think what is clear is we need a specific comment from the government - can dealers deliver or not. It should be quote simple. I've emailed the business department and treasury today to ask them, and the SMMT. I'll see if any of them come back with a comment. Might try and hound them on Twitter too.

Glad you enjoyed the article and thanks all for your comments

[have a word with the wife 299]

When we watch the daily update on the virus from the government we see, graphs, how many died today, how many new cases etc, one of the graphs, shows motor vehicle movement, you might say this pedantic, [right word? ] so we deliver a car, there is no way that as a customer your not going to have a spin out in this new to you car, so other dealers think, hang on, cazoo are doing it right ? why can i not ? so the government see this increase in traffic, and extend the lockdown, simples, so those that are doing the right thing, staying at home, are, in theory, penalised even further, loss of income.

No problem at all taking orders, my thinking being, when we are instructed that we are not classed as none essential, then with diligence, we can return, i was asked if, if i had a vehicle "ready" could they collect it ? short answer no, we are in lockdown, and breaking the law by opening up, but they said, we would observe the rules, that is not going to happen is it ? can i use your toilet ? whats that one over there ? bigger companies have "given" cars to key workers, strongly checking there story of being "stuck" one would think, this sort of help will, long term bear fruit for these companies, a point cazoo, all set up to do, have failed on, [50% sales to key workers yes there figures ?] should that not be 100%?

If the car transporter on empty return could at least distribute ppe equipment to the

nhs ?

You may have seen earlier, on another thread my "lighthearted " view on this company, made a few of you chuckle, but the bottom line is, this company is taking other peoples business? putting staff at risk ? encouraging traffic to increase? it is just not cricket !

On a thursday night, at 8 o clock, i stand at my door, yes, with a tear in my eye, clapping for the nhs, the key workers, the delivery drivers, the guy on the checkout at aldi,all the great people that are keeping us going, and if a cazoo wagon goes past, well, i cannot say 

 

[awc1000 93]

well its legal to sell and quite safe to do so if you are organised, the reality is if cazoo sell online then deliver on a wagon by 1 driver who has zero contact with the customer on delivery bar a phone call to say your car will arrive within the next hour please stay indoors and i will notify you when i have left your address - then that chaps is 100% safe and water tight, morals are another thing i guess...

there are two camps of thought here - i would suggest some of the against camp do not have the business model capable of operating during this crisis, its obviously harder for a single trader to operate in this climate who's model is still - meet greet, can we see the p/ex, i'll get it ready for you next week, you'll have to sign up for it here, we dont deliver, we have to explain the bolt on warranty here,  we are worried about distance selling, our client base is mostly cash customers etc etc.

like it or not chaps this game has moved on, with respect some are stuck in the dark ages, same old plan, rent a unit, buy all stock from auction, pay for everything else,just man the phone and moan about the costs.

take a look at cazoo - as of today, they have 2280 cars on the site, a search reveals about 1850 are aged between 2017 and 2020 and all sub 50k miles and the bulk of stock even lower - ALL or mostly ALL are still in manufacturers warranty hence they are not in the slightest worried about distance selling or warranty's, theyre not spending fortunes on prep either, i'm not blowing their trumpet because at the end of the day they are bad news for everyone else, but it has to be said the stock profile and quality of car for 2000 units is impressive.

this job forever changes just as you get used to it and yes its a total pain, but as usual chaps its a case of run with the new way of trading or get run over by it....good luck everyone and stay safe.

[New year revolutions...... 197]

One of the fundamental problems of cars is they are built out of many parts

Unfortunately  many of these parts have to work in conjunction with other parts that are of a mechanical nature ie they interact with each other and thus have a propensity to fail 

Unfortunately cars do not like being parked up, this is one of the main reasons a car needs a full and proper pdi  before it is taken on a proper test drive followed up my a fresh pair of eyes giving it a full proper appraised mot

I fail to see how this can be properly achieved on a ramp and then strapped on the back of a wagon and delivered via a pair of extended forceps

Nick gave a podcast last week and I hope he doesn't mind me mentioning it but he is going to court

Why

Because he sold a picanto that after a pdi a road test and a proper mot  the caliper pin seized,why do I mention this? because 3 years ago I had exactly the same problem on the same model ,fortunately  as the rolling road figures are there to be seen you could see a discrepancy on the needles but here's the silly bit it was within mot limits and passed,back at work a stripdown again did indeed find the semi seized slide pin  it had been missed

Would I want to be selling cars from a field in Doncaster having my mechanic give them a pdi and then an mot and send them out.

Place your bets

[metcars 397]

12 minutes ago, New year revolutions...... said:

One of the fundamental problems of cars is they are built out of many parts

Unfortunately  many of these parts have to work in conjunction with other parts that are of a mechanical nature ie they interact with each other and thus have a propensity to fail 

Unfortunately cars do not like being parked up, this is one of the main reasons a car needs a full and proper pdi  before it is taken on a proper test drive followed up my a fresh pair of eyes giving it a full proper appraised mot

I fail to see how this can be properly achieved on a ramp and then strapped on the back of a wagon and delivered via a pair of extended forceps

Nick gave a podcast last week and I hope he doesn't mind me mentioning it but he is going to court

Why

Because he sold a picanto that after a pdi a road test and a proper mot  the caliper pin seized,why do I mention this? because 3 years ago I had exactly the same problem on the same model ,fortunately  as the rolling road figures are there to be seen you could see a discrepancy on the needles but here's the silly bit it was within mot limits and passed,back at work a stripdown again did indeed find the semi seized slide pin  it had been missed

Would I want to be selling cars from a field in Doncaster having my mechanic give them a pdi and then an mot and send them out.

Place your bets

It’s the future, but not as we know it?

19 minutes ago, awc1000 said:

well its legal to sell and quite safe to do so if you are organised, the reality is if cazoo sell online then deliver on a wagon by 1 driver who has zero contact with the customer on delivery bar a phone call to say your car will arrive within the next hour please stay indoors and i will notify you when i have left your address - then that chaps is 100% safe and water tight, morals are another thing i guess...

there are two camps of thought here - i would suggest some of the against camp do not have the business model capable of operating during this crisis, its obviously harder for a single trader to operate in this climate who's model is still - meet greet, can we see the p/ex, i'll get it ready for you next week, you'll have to sign up for it here, we dont deliver, we have to explain the bolt on warranty here,  we are worried about distance selling, our client base is mostly cash customers etc etc.

like it or not chaps this game has moved on, with respect some are stuck in the dark ages, same old plan, rent a unit, buy all stock from auction, pay for everything else,just man the phone and moan about the costs.

take a look at cazoo - as of today, they have 2280 cars on the site, a search reveals about 1850 are aged between 2017 and 2020 and all sub 50k miles and the bulk of stock even lower - ALL or mostly ALL are still in manufacturers warranty hence they are not in the slightest worried about distance selling or warranty's, theyre not spending fortunes on prep either, i'm not blowing their trumpet because at the end of the day they are bad news for everyone else, but it has to be said the stock profile and quality of car for 2000 units is impressive.

this job forever changes just as you get used to it and yes its a total pain, but as usual chaps its a case of run with the new way of trading or get run over by it....good luck everyone and stay safe.

Good post. Big changes ahead. Money to be made for those flexible enough to adapt and change quickly?

[Mojo121 229]

44 minutes ago, BHM said:

Tbh I struggle to disagree with this point of view. Half of the restrictions are bollocks due to the weak implementation of controls.

The govt would of been better operating like a Communist state, instructed everyone to stay at home & enforced it with public floggings but I guess they don’t have the legal powers so we ended up with scenes such as those in London parks sunning themselves rubbing suntan lotion into each other’s backs.

Anyone who thinks being 2mtrs from an infected person in a supermarket queue who is coughing & spluttering is going to be saved is misguided.

Two points on this:

1. The pandemic has removed part of our personal freedoms, would you really want lose more of that through a communist system being in place? We’re already looking at losing some part of our personal liberty in future when this ISN’T all over - things won’t go back to how they were. Government tracking apps, vaccines etc all being openly discussed.

2. Very good point about the supermarkets. They are surely the worst places to go? Don’t they have air recirculation systems? Do the filters eliminate the virus, or harbour it? I remember working in offices, as the newbie and getting constantly sick and being told “it’s the air con, everyone has a bit of time off when they start”. Don’t know how much truth is in that but it was my experience.
 

I have heard multiple first hand stories of deaths being recorded Covid when there were extensive mitigating circumstances and in response to someone above MANY people die every week. I received the text below the other week. Sorry this is all a bit off topic.
 

Interesting to note the number of deaths by week, last year compared to this year. 

*Source:*
Public Health England - All-cause mortality

                      *2020*    *2019*

Week 1:         12,254   10,955
Week 2:         14,058   12,609
Week 3:         12,990   11,860
Week 4:         11,856   11,740
Week 5:         11,612   11,297
Week 6:         10,986   11,660
Week 7:         10,944   11,824
Week 8:         10,841   11,295
Week 9:         10,816   11,044
Week 10:       10,895   10,898
Week 11:       11,019   10,567

stastics can be verified from https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

*Intention for sending:* 

Reduce fear, anxiety and worry over reports about the number of people dying 

Statistically, so far, the numbers of deaths in the UK, even with Covid-19 are in line with what is expected each week, every year.

[metcars 397]

Hey James, does this website have the ability to do a poll? Even anonymously? Just to see what percentage of us are still trading? 

[have a word with the wife 299]

7 minutes ago, metcars said:

Hey James, does this website have the ability to do a poll? Even anonymously? Just to see what percentage of us are still trading? 

done

 https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/forum/topic/8680-are-you-actively-trading/

 

[awc1000 93]

31 minutes ago, New year revolutions...... said:

One of the fundamental problems of cars is they are built out of many parts

Unfortunately  many of these parts have to work in conjunction with other parts that are of a mechanical nature ie they interact with each other and thus have a propensity to fail 

Unfortunately cars do not like being parked up, this is one of the main reasons a car needs a full and proper pdi  before it is taken on a proper test drive followed up my a fresh pair of eyes giving it a full proper appraised mot

I fail to see how this can be properly achieved on a ramp and then strapped on the back of a wagon and delivered via a pair of extended forceps

Nick gave a podcast last week and I hope he doesn't mind me mentioning it but he is going to court

Why

Because he sold a picanto that after a pdi a road test and a proper mot  the caliper pin seized,why do I mention this? because 3 years ago I had exactly the same problem on the same model ,fortunately  as the rolling road figures are there to be seen you could see a discrepancy on the needles but here's the silly bit it was within mot limits and passed,back at work a stripdown again did indeed find the semi seized slide pin  it had been missed

Would I want to be selling cars from a field in Doncaster having my mechanic give them a pdi and then an mot and send them out.

Place your bets

all good points, but again i'm sorry to say its not an issue, carzoo are contracted into bca for all spanner work, these bca centres are stand alone prep sites NOT on site at the bca auctions, bedford aerodrome being just one, banbury another, ive been on both sites, sad to tell you all its all very slick - in summary they are selling quality late low mileage cars still in manufacturers warranty and prepped properly.

and i also here because of there appetite for buying this type of stock they are now being offered and buying direct from fleets not just auction, so after starting out by holding stock for a long time before launch they have swiftly moved onto muscling in on supply which will = profit moving forwards.

[New year revolutions...... 197]

17 minutes ago, awc1000 said:

all good points, but again i'm sorry to say its not an issue, carzoo are contracted into bca for all spanner work, these bca centres are stand alone prep sites NOT on site at the bca auctions, bedford aerodrome being just one, banbury another, ive been on both sites, sad to tell you all its all very slick - in summary they are selling quality late low mileage cars still in manufacturers warranty and prepped properly.

and i also here because of there appetite for buying this type of stock they are now being offered and buying direct from fleets not just auction, so after starting out by holding stock for a long time before launch they have swiftly moved onto muscling in on supply which will = profit moving forwards.

Thanks for the insight

[metcars 397]

37 minutes ago, have a word with the wife said:

done

 https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/forum/topic/8680-are-you-actively-trading/

 

Thanks

[Casper 272]

22 minutes ago, awc1000 said:

all good points, but again i'm sorry to say its not an issue, carzoo are contracted into bca for all spanner work, these bca centres are stand alone prep sites NOT on site at the bca auctions, bedford aerodrome being just one, banbury another, ive been on both sites, sad to tell you all its all very slick - in summary they are selling quality late low mileage cars still in manufacturers warranty and prepped properly.

and i also here because of there appetite for buying this type of stock they are now being offered and buying direct from fleets not just auction, so after starting out by holding stock for a long time before launch they have swiftly moved onto muscling in on supply which will = profit moving forwards.

Ive always said cars could be bought direct from fleet if buying in big enough amounts . If money was no object and had a biggest enough business and turn over I think most fleet managers would be willing to do business if someone was coming to me in there portion and offered to buy for talking sakes  100 units i know i would give it serious thought . 

[New year revolutions...... 197]

2 minutes ago, Casper said:

Ive always said cars could be bought direct from fleet if buying in big enough amounts . If money was no object and had a biggest enough business and turn over I think most fleet managers would be willing to do business if someone was coming to me in there portion and offered to buy for talking sakes  100 units i know i would give it serious thought . 

That's alright until 89 blue cars turn up in one splodge oh and the contract say YOUhave to de sticker them

 

 

Sucker

[Casper 272]

7 minutes ago, New year revolutions...... said:

That's alright until 89 blue cars turn up in one splodge oh and the contract say YOUhave to de sticker them

 

 

Sucker

Yeah its not something for the independent or even franchise but I guess it might work for a company like  Cazoo or even arnold clark with multiple branches in-fact they  had a lot of ex company silver 15 plates 308 estates on recently although i think there retailing a lot of there own contract hire stuff i bought a few in the past thats had been on contact with the nhs from auction probably 10 years ago when they sold there contract hire  stuff there 

have you seen some of the retail stuff they have seen an octavia at 4 years old touching a 150 k miles 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Casper

[BHM 994]

2 hours ago, metcars said:

play Russian roulette with my life over a shitty 10yr old focus!

Shitty Focus! Never mind the heart complaint, surely you meant Immaculate, superbly maintained, well appointed family hatchback offering outstanding economy at an attractive price. 

[awc1000 93]

7 minutes ago, Casper said:

Yeah its not something for the independent or even franchise but I guess it might work for a company like  Cazoo or even arnold clark with multiple branches in-fact they  had a lot of ex company silver 15 plates 308 estates on recently although i think there retailing a lot of there own contract hire stuff i bought a few in the past thats had been on contact with the nhs from auction probably 10 years ago when they sold there contract hire  stuff there 

have you seen some of the retail stuff they have seen an octavia at 4 years old touching a 150 k miles 

dont think this type of stock will be on the radar for carzoo, 

one train of thought - for me this job is and always was about contacts, thinking like that can you imagine the circles in which the carzoo founder mix's in, probably the same circles as the owners of some of the fleet companys fleet users and certain u.k franchise directors, all manufacturers have late fleets that they disperse of on a regular basis, can you imagine the conversations these folks are having whilst socialising on each others yachts in the med?? it might already explain where carzoo are getting some of that nice late stock from.

[have a word with the wife 299]

26th march= quote

Cazoo has suspended deliveries of vehicles during the coronavirus crisis.The company, which has enjoyed a high profile and plenty of publicity since its launch 15 months ago, said on social media that it had set itself three guiding principles as the Covid-19 outbreak began to dominate the news agenda.The first one was that all employees should be kept as safe and healthy as possible; the second was that Cazoo customers should enjoy the highest possible standards of customer service; and the third was that the company would take whatever action it could to slow and stop the spread of the disease. unquote...................

There is no known cure..................very chilling

the 2 metre gap is a guide..............a guide

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by have a word with the wife

[Nick. 1]

https://fleetworld.co.uk/restart-vehicle-deliveries-to-aid-covid-19-relief-effort-says-bvrla/

 

 

Start delivery of vehicles!!!

[metcars 397]

5 hours ago, Nick. said:

https://fleetworld.co.uk/restart-vehicle-deliveries-to-aid-covid-19-relief-effort-says-bvrla/

 

 

Start delivery of vehicles!!!

Are hgv drivers classed as essential anyway? I keep seeing stuff on social media about how they are working but no support. Can’t find cafes open or hotels etc. 

Edited April 19, 2020 by metcars