Help...... unusual one! Customer dosnt want full refund!

[Traderup 0]

Hi,

First post but used the forum a few times so hi to all. 

Sorry if I have missed a post with this info but I can’t find anything on it  

A week ago a young man purchased a 15 year old **** diesel from us for £1,650. After a couple of days he said the car was using water...... we asked him to bring the car back and we will look at it. He said he was using the car and would bring it back the weekend (just gone). I said that would be fine but as the mechanics don’t work weekends unfortunately it would be Monday before we were able to look at the car. He stated in that case he will wait until Monday to bring it back. Later he asked for a courtesy car to which I reminded him that when he visitored us we are a small family run business and don’t have courtesy cars..... he replied ‘ok’. Over the weekend he then identified an electric window wasn’t working and there is apparently a pipe missing from the heating system also, and as is his right, these need fixing. We replied saying that we will look at those when he brings the car back to us on Monday. Yesterday he sent a further message saying he requires a courtesy car as he cannot be without a car to get to work. Again we replied (Sunday afternoon) saying that he should bring the car back as agreed Monday and we will inspect the car while he waits, if the problems he has stated are correct we will give him a full refund of his purchase price. Surprisingly he has then replied a few hours later saying he dosnt want a refund he wants the car repairing. 

can anyone tell me in respect of the consumer act and general small claims law if he can invoke a repair as opposed to the full refund we have offered? I feel we have been fair and also polite and tried to accommodate the customers grievance? At this stage I do not want to be repairing such an old ‘cheap’ vehicle with possibly a big problem (loosing water) and dealing with what seems a difficult customer. I’d appreciate anyone’s help on this matter before a reply to him to be honest.

many thanks.

 

 

[Grantlfc81 88]

Just fix the car? What’s the problem 

[EPV 631]

The car is his. It’s not up to you what he does with it. 

He is entitled to a car that is free from faults, which are defined as making the vehicle of unsatisfactory quality, unfit for purpose or not as described. 

I’d say a car loosing coolant and a window not working deem the car of unsatisfactory quality therefore he is entitled to a repair. 

He potentially could be entitled to the short term right to reject as the car could be deemed unfit for purpose however he is choosing not to exercise his right to the short term right to reject and favours a repair. That’s his right. 

Get the car back, repair it and get it back to him. 

You say you don’t want to repair the car that’s so old etc but want to refund him. If he did accept a refund, what are you going to do with the car, scrap it? 

[Mojo121 229]

Jesus, seems like everyone on this forum has got a problem customer!

Anyway, in terms of doing what you want to do. Get the car back, state the car is irreparable and uneconomical to repair and hence a full refund is his only option. Problem solved.

8 minutes ago, EPV said:

You say you don’t want to repair the car that’s so old etc but want to refund him. If he did accept a refund, what are you going to do with the car, scrap it? 

Flog it from the back of Tesco I reckon.

[trade vet 702]

Tell him he cannot use the car anymore and give instructions that you will collect it from his home at a certain time.In the past when these guys talk about not been able to get to work I usually establish where they work and then  refer them to public transport.Please let us know how far he travels to work and in future when selling cheapies it is a good idea to qualify the customer.

[Mark101 536]

10 minutes ago, Mojo121 said:

Anyway, in terms of doing what you want to do. Get the car back, state the car is irreparable and uneconomical to repair and hence a full refund is his only option. Problem solved.

This

Worst case you'll end up with a ton of scrap but an over expectant customer out of your life.

Edited November 5, 2018 by Mark101

[Traderup 0]

Thanks for the replies. 

I am trying to get the car back, I have offered repair on all his concerns..... the problem is he won’t bring the car back unless I provide a courtesy car. So hence I have offered a full refund by resolution. 

My question stands.... can he refuse the offer of a full refund and demand repair legally? 

Cheers

[Rory RSC 596]

14 minutes ago, Traderup said:

Thanks for the replies. 

I am trying to get the car back, I have offered repair on all his concerns..... the problem is he won’t bring the car back unless I provide a courtesy car. So hence I have offered a full refund by resolution. 

My question stands.... can he refuse the offer of a full refund and demand repair legally? 

Cheers

No he cannot force you to repair a car if its not economical.

If its a pipe and its going to take 2 mins to repair then just do it. If the headgaskets gone and you can't be bothered reparing as its not worthwhile and want to block it then give him his money back and avoid further issues. 

[Nick M.K. 574]

41 minutes ago, Traderup said:

My question stands.... can he refuse the offer of a full refund and demand repair legally? 

NO. 

He is entitled to get a refund or repair and also you are entitled to offer a refund or repair. 

The electric window isn't a big issue on an end-of-life car, the coolant loss (if major) IS. 

 

Offer him the repair once again reiterating that a courtesy vehicle is not an option here and ultimately he will probably come around. 

[Mark101 536]

I am sorry to learn that you have issues with the car you have recently purchased from us.  We always strive to offer reliable cars regardless of cost; This said, given the retalively low value of your vehicle, it is uneconomical for us to perform a repair.  Fortunately, we are reputable dealer and as such we have made an offer to refund the vehicle in full and without any deduction for usage, the only requirement on you being that the vehicle needs to be returned to us within 24 hours with any original documentation, keys and should be in the same physical condition as when you collected the car.  If we do not hear from you, we shall presume that you are happy to keep the car with all of the faults present and that our offer will expire on 7th November at 10.00 am. (24 hours after receiving letter/email).

RECORDED DELIVERY

[EPV 631]

41 minutes ago, Traderup said:

Thanks for the replies. 

I am trying to get the car back, I have offered repair on all his concerns..... the problem is he won’t bring the car back unless I provide a courtesy car. So hence I have offered a full refund by resolution. 

My question stands.... can he refuse the offer of a full refund and demand repair legally? 

Cheers

This is a simple email to him confirming his right to a repair and he needs to return the car to you. It’s unfortunate regarding his transportation requirements but you are a used car dealer not a large mechanical garage and you will do all you can to get it inspected and repaired ASAP so he’s back on the road.

Point out to him it’s unwise to continue driving the car if it’s losing coolant so you recommend he stops driving it and brings it back to you ASAP. Remind him you won’t be liable to fix any further issues as a result of him driving the car when there is a leak  

 

[Stalker 180]

He isn't entitled to a courtesy car as long as his car is repaired in a "reasonable time".

If hes local, we often collect the car from their work and kidnap it and try and get it back to them before they finish work.

This is often a problem if the customer works in the public sector and finishes work at 11am!

 

[Nick M.K. 574]

17 minutes ago, Stalker said:

This is often a problem if the customer works in the public sector and finishes work at 11am!

Hahahahaha. 

The saddest thing is, this wasn't even a joke.

[NOACROSS 414]

You need to write to him quickly explaining that continued use of the car, can and will probably cause damage to the vehicle -which you will not be responsible for.  Again remind him you are happy to inspect, fix and/or refund once you've diagnosed the fault.

On handover as part of the process we point out what happens in the unlikely event of the car having a problem (return to base usually) and that we do not operate a courtesy car (we do, but we but don't publicise this and only lend it out to normal, nice people).  

They read and sign and get a copy with the Pdi sheet etc.

What diesel car is this out of interest? German? Vauxhall?

 

[Nick M.K. 574]

15 year old diesel at £1650 will be a Ford or something French with below average miles or might even be German with 150K+ miles. I'll go German. 

A diesel Vauxhall at that age will be nearer the £650 mark :-)

Edited November 5, 2018 by Nick M.K.

[Dave2302 387]

5 hours ago, Nick M.K. said:

A diesel Vauxhall at that age will be nearer the £650 mark :-)

I think you got the decimal Point in the wrong place, more like £6.50 

[Nick M.K. 574]

1 hour ago, Dave2302 said:

I think you got the decimal Point in the wrong place, more like £6.50

That customer would be crazy to accept a full refund 

57 minutes ago, tradex said:

why not mention the make, model and miles?

+1 ???

[mike101 8]

I had this a few years back. Oil pickup pipe fractured on an Impreza in first 10 days of ownership  - got the car back, engine was toast.

They wanted it repaired, we said that would be betterment unles they were prepared to contribute. They declined and refused a refund. Had to threaten legals to get V5 and spare key back.

Repaired and sold for £3k more 8 weeks later. Covered the engine build cost.

It all comes down to the test of reasonableness again. The customer would have to take you to court for breaking the contract and argue you were being unreasonable by offering them a refund! Admittedly there aren’t many situations when this makes sense as normally the repair doesn’t make it worth more but proves the point you can play them at their own game sometimes.