RH Trading

what does IMDA think Umesh? What are your views on it? Personally believe it needs to be independently moderated and run like reviews and star ratings rather than a "rogues gallery" - leaving it up to dealers to name other dealers on a forum is open to abuse and easily misinterpreted

we use WMS on the cars that need it, cant fault them. must have had the same experience as Rory as wouldn't go near Warrantywise with a barge pole

I had the free package for most of last year, lots of emails but none of them turned into a sale, the guy on the phone offered a 3 month free trial on their standard paid for package and quoted £550 per month for 35 cars if I signed up for 9 months after free trial ended. I didn't take them up as it meant committing to nearly £5000, that was January so looks like I was quoted the new price? Still on freebie at the moment

Sales tips and closing techniques? that's for the franchise big boys and the shady supermarkets with their suits and their Pendle trained, admin fee, lava hot coffee, I'll ask the manager, throw in free car mats tricks who don't care what car they put someone in as long as they hit their target. Balloons, big wavey men, bunting and boots open? - maybe 20 years ago but the car is 90% sold before the buyer turns up in my experience these days. they usually come for a specific car they've seen online and as everyone above has already said if you handle it right, test drive and don't pressure people, people buy the car - that's not the hard part, that's 10% of the job. not sure what you're paying £65-£70 per car on stationary, think that's my stationary budget for the year. are you literally gift wrapping each car? if you're the owner operator of a small dealership theres no such thing as regular hours, its 24/7 but I employ 2 people in my sales team and they're fantastic. they work alternate weekends between them, start at 10 and are still here most night at 6-7, depends on how busy we are. we have live chat and that's always on and responded to within minutes. we ditched shirts and ties about 5 years ago and have some nice branded uniforms, cargo pants, polo shirts and fleeces, buy in bulk with a range of colours and the guys love them. its all common sense tbh. people aren't stupid in my experience and can spot when you're coming on with any sales techniques - we had someone in at the weekend, they looked at Q5 S line, lovely car, £25k, they went away to look at another at local Audi main dealer but came back and bought ours, they said they didn't like the pushy sales person who didn't really car about them - nothing wrong with the car. that's where we win, as small independents we can give so much more than some of the big boys by NOT being your stereotypical dealer

Its a tough decision as there are so many choices out there and getting it wrong can have massive impact on your business so don't rush your decision or purely base it on price John. Like anything you get what you pay for with websites For me its Click Dealer, been with them for nearly 2 years now due to many reasons. Service, price, functionality, speed, website traffic tools, aesthetic design of website, mobile optimisation (very important), the back end DMS functionality, the way they seem to continually update and invest in growing my business, give me insight and data on response, finance functionality, ability to run invoicing, which channels are working and which clearly aren't, enabling me to work out my ROI and stop wasting money on motors, eBay etc. Had experience of GForces in the past, they charge for every small design change and I think are better suited for larger main dealers and supermarkets. Not had experience of any of the others so cant say but did look at Autoweb when we moved away from GForces but they didn't get back to me after initial enquiry and I had to ring them several times, spoke to 2-3 different people so gave up in the end, however this is just my opinion, my friend has a cardealer 5 website and is happy with it. BTW I don't work for Click and Im not on commission

If you've got time, try and track down the service history. Its happened to me a few times buying at BCA with no books or service history only to track down copies from the main dealer. sometimes ex company cars don't carry the history as the driver couldn't be arsed, its not his car, but 9 times out of 10 it has a book full of main dealer stamps, particularly ex lease vehicles

Been a very busy end of March and Easter bank holiday for us. 36 cars sold in March and better still zero comebacks (so far and quickly touches wood) only 1 where an A3 had a slow puncture but I'm not counting that This will be a record month for us, we stock around 30 and aim for 40 days stock turn and around £750 ppu which we've also hit. Saying that I've probably completely jinxed April but have 3 on the board already so not looking bad so far, long may it continue

Used to have a Snapon Modis but went obsolete last year and baulked a little at the price of the replacement we've used an Autel Maxisys Pro MS908 for past 6 months and must say very impressed, better than the Snapon or Mac . Big selling point for me was the fact its blutooth/wifi so can throw away the cables, very tough as well, as been dropped by clumsy technicians more than once but still absolutely fine. think its was about £1100 + vat but worth the money. I'd recommend buying a spare sd card and backup just to be on the safe side

Agree with all of the above, make sure you're aware of your commitments to them as well, don't jump in bed with the first company who makes you an offer, or sign up for a long term commitment. There are plenty of finance houses out there, we've used 5-6 in the past, and still use Close and Santandar you've just got to pick the one you think works best for you, helps support your business as well as offering decent commissions

He's got the same number of cars but he's on the billy basic start up package as he begrudges spending a penny. I do pay more, but I get more. He's paying around £1800 for 30 cars and selling 13 cars (give or take) from autotrader per month. His cost to sell is around £138 approximately. Yes - I pay more for 30 cars - £2593 per month for 30 cars, From the autotrader - I sold 22 cars in Feb, January 28 cars, December 19 cars, November 25 cars, October 29 cars, so far in March I'm on 29 cars. Total spend for past 6 months = £15,558, total cars sold as a direct result of AutoTrader in last 6 months - 152. Cost of sale per car = £102 average for last 6 months. and I still think I can do better. My average net profit per car is £769, total net profit from those 152 sales in past 6 months is £120,232 as of today so my dms tells me. He's a bit old school John (neighbour) and see's it just as a massive cost rather than an investment, doesn't really monitor, he's in almost daily though asking me to icontol some of his cars the cheeky bugger, he actually stocks about 50 but says he cant afford to advertise the lot. So short answer is - Yes I'm happy to be paying more because I'm selling more and its actually costing less, its just simple maths. it works for me, speculate to accumulate and all that. I take the emotion out of it, I don't like everything the autotrader does and disagree with many of the new things they've brought out but its by far the best channel of selling cars for me - that's what my facts are telling me regardless of what I personally think how many cars and how much profit made on those sales have you received for your £2m investment Trade Vet?

Why? if it doesn't work cancel, no one is forcing you to advertise on the autotrader, I cancelled motors cause it didn't work, I'm not angry or mad about it, it was business, I cancelled findandfundmycar cause it didn't work, I don't complain, lesson learned (expensive lesson) I reinvested my money in something that worked better. I'm not delighted at the prices but am more than happy with my sales levels and profits generated as a result. cant understand why some dealers still use them if they're not selling cars and measuring the net profits returned - well done Arthur for being brave enough to cut the ties as he cant make it work for him. I have videos on all my cars, minimum of 50 great photo's 165, 5 star reviews. I'm not the cheapest but make sure I check my prices weekly as per my reps advice. I'm not bragging but had a record January, not great feb and a very healthy March so far. Looking through my click dealer, leads and sales so far - 78% of them came out of area from leads generated by the autotrader. I don't advertise anywhere else as they don't work for me. as for prices being different, I have a different package then my friend over the road but we both have 35 stock contract. I pay around £600 more than him per month. I think I get more for my money than he does as he is daily whinging about autotrader, he tells me he sells between 10-15 cars a month from them but he's on a cheaper package so gets less. You pay for what you get. I'm old enough and ugly enough to remember advertising in the midland autotrader where it cost £30 for a double spot with 1 photo and 27 words, its a different world now and a different market but I'm selling more than I did then for less cost overall. if you can make it work, sell cars and make a decent profit then happy days. If not then there are plenty of other channels out there, pick one (or 6) and make it work for you.

let me get this straight - the only way you're going to find out if the autotrader is working for you is by cancelling to see if it doesn't have an impact on your sales Arthur? as a franchised dealer do you have a marketing department? I'd be giving them a right kick up the arse. do they not measure it for you? I'm very surprised. My Click dealer website shows me exactly where my traffic is coming from. My call monitoring system shows me exactly how many calls I get and from where. I know exactly to the penny how much I spend on advertising and how much it costs and I budget and change campaigns accordingly, cut out what doesn't work, give new starters a few months trial and monitor and measure every penny. I notice you said before you're spending £900 per month on findandfundmycar yet you said you hadn't sold a car from it? that to me is expensive. get complaining to them we all wish the autotrader was cheaper and this has been the perennial cry from dealers for past 20 years, its nothing new. to be honest I don't care what anybody else is paying, I care what I'm getting. what does it matter if Arthur is paying less - its not working for him. even if it was free - its not working for him I cancelled AT thanks to some really bad advice 2 years ago for 3 months and encouraged to try Jim Reids autovolo and was the worst 3 months trading I had in 20 years (sales dropped from 30-35 to 11 per month) I posted this earlier on a different thread Motors - Cost £480 pm - 30 cars advertised - 3 emails, no sales in 6 months. Profit from sales as a direct result of Motors - Loss of £2880 Findandfundmycar - Cost £245 pm - 30 cars advertised no enquiries no sales in 2 months. Profit from sales as a result of findandfundcar - Loss of £490 AutoTrader - Cost £2593 pm - 30 cars advertised - 57 phone calls, 19 calls from mobile app, 17 emails, 7 part ex leads (no deals) 4 finance leads (2 deals done) 22 direct sales - LAST MONTH! - Profit from sales as a result of autotrader £14,107 (net after advertising) I wish it was cheaper and am not overjoyed with paying more but would be even more pissed off if I was paying that and not selling any cars or making any profit. cancelling to see if you can do without it seems like saying I don't think I need oxygen so will try not to breath for a day Question for Arthur - are you expecting to sell more cars or less due to this? Good luck this is my own opinion, I know it doesn't work for everyone and it does for some but I encourage everyone to measure, if it doesn't work cancel - find what works for you but. don't make the mistake I made 2 years ago. things are tough enough as they are guys

Click Dealer all day long for me. great guys. I recommend you have your own website Mark, it builds trust with buyers - they may suspect something if you don't have your own website in this day and age - I advertise all my 40 cars on the autotrader and monitor it religiously. I have my own tracking software that shows people find my car on AT first, then for some reason many of them go onto Google and type in my name to find my website (even though there's a big visit website button on my adverts) Don't exactly know why they do it but it must be how they research. Anyway having your own website is very important, In nearly 20 years I've had 4 different providers and swear by the Click Dealer guys

Thought this was going to be another "slashing wrists" post about how terrible it is, glad we're all doing OK though, there's enough doom and gloom out there without us talking one another into depression, decent start to March, 35 in stock, 13 sold so far, January was a record for us, Feb a little quieter, always tends to be for us but thankfully decent margins in all. Like Arfur Dealy says, the age old problem for us is sourcing stock, never have a issue with selling but spend almost as much time now out buying and going further and further afield, trying to avoid the auctions like the plague as prices are getting further and further away from reality.

CAP used to be the bible but lost the plot years ago, I've never used Glasses, there are so many more accurate ways of pricing out there than those 2 dinosaurs, half of them free

You've been charged £895 per month for 125 cars? No I can categorically say everyone isn't paying the same then, My bill was £325 + vat per month for 35 cars. I was told that some of the supermarkets were free of charge due to them being desperate for cars. I cancelled due to zero response, the motornovo rep tried to hold me to 12 months, it was a real headache but they finally agreed to let me cancel but only after I threatened legal action (I do notice my cars are still on there though so half of me is expecting another bill) So for 3 months you'll have paid £2685, and you've not sold anything yet? hope it picks up for you

I have an MOT testing area and to be fair we have to apply the same DOT measures against every vehicle - we're not given any wriggle room at all, and are inspected regularly. its a very rigorous procedure and a lot of red tape involved. if the tester didn't follow the above then I bet the odd person would complain and the testing centre would be stripped of its license

No - not an email, finance enquiry, phone call, nothing for 10 weeks. The most expensive advertising I've ever done, @ £7 per car they are well and truly shafting the dealers, people talk about AutoTrader being a rip off but at least it works, on top of that I was told by my motornovo rep (who up till this fiasco launched was fantastic but now very cold) that this will mean my commissions might be cut. Aw well, more business for Santander. this whole site should have been free to dealers to advertise stock until we start getting a response then charge us a fair price to advertise, not paying for a promise that it might one day in a few years time might, just might deliver some sales. I couldn't believe from day one they were asking dealers to pay £7 per car, tying them into long contracts then saying they were using this money to market themselves. So really no risk to Motornovo, no initial outlay on building audience and no marketing cost as this was already covered form the dealers pocket MOTONOVO - if you want it to work, give it away free till its worth charging for. you'd then get all the cars from dealers instead of the paltry 60,000 cars you have on there which in turn would drive people to come to the site. You're going to fail but you wont care because its cost you nothing - you're getting hundreds of thousands of pounds every month from dealers and not delivering, just speaking for myself here but hate wasting money

hahaha - reminds me of that Cadburys advert with the little girl emptying her pockets to buy a block of chocolate for her mum, An ex cricket club greenskeeper once tried to part ex a motorised roller many many years ago.

Always amazes me how far people will travel and NOT buy. early January couple came up from Exeter, must have driven nearly 4 hrs, test drive an A3, loved the car, all the right noises, happy with the appraisal of their car, then BANG! proceeded to pull out print outs of older, tattier, higher mileage A3's with less spec and said obviously ours was over priced compared to all these other examples and went on to demand a reasonable (in their words) discount of £2000 off the £9500 we had it up for. I politely declined, went through the discrepancies of the print outs one by f@&#ing one. they just didn't seem to care, after a while I said obviously we weren't going to do business, thanked them for their interest and wished them a safe journey back to Exeter. They spent another hour sat outside in their car talking before they drove off. I wish I could end this on "they rang back the next day to offer the full amount but I'd already sold it in the mean time and took pleasure in telling them that" but nope, just never heard from them again, it was another 3 weeks till we sold it to someone from Sheffield for £9350

I feel your pain, Birmingham fan here and surrounded but Wolves fans

I remember advertising in the midlands autotrader in 2004, about 10 emperor spots (£35 a week) at first, then went to a half page at £680 for one week with 20 cars on it. for that I got a grainy black and white half page with about 15 words maximum on each car that went out to the Birmingham area. I remember Gerry the rep taking my photos on a Monday to get them in for that Friday and by the time it came out, about a quarter of the cars had sold so wasted cash, and a lot of the time the photo would be wrong or phone number wrong and theyd just say, have a free credit for next week. Anyway point being it cost a lot then for a pretty shitty magazine but it worked and we made money. today it costs me about the same for a decent website that sells me more cars and I'm still making decent money. Its not a question of suck it up, if you don't think its working and you're not making money from it cancel and try something else. I'm not a fan of the prices, wish it was cheaper as does everyone but it WORKS! if someone worked half as well like motors or fleabay or Scumtree theyd charge just as much wouldn't they? the dearest advertising is the advertising that doesn't work - findmycarfun.com - DIDNT WORK for me and cost me money, Motors - didn't work for me and cost me money. AutoTrader works for me and makes me money. and you don't need the Motoring Advertising Union as you've already got the IMDA to sort things like this out. btw Ive never known them to drop their prices or not have an increase Avon Valley - when was this? have I missed something?

Love reviews, customers always comment about mine, might not have sold me any more cars but it certainly helps differentiate me from Fred in the shed down the road who purely sells on price and doesn't give a toss about aftersales or service. Had a gentleman at the weekend travel down from Stirling for a Focus at the weekend who said he read all my reviews before he set off and knew he could trust me. Still each to their own I imagine but don't understand why you wouldn't use them. People can leave reviews about you anywhere nowadays so better to look after your customer and send them a review request than sit and wait for the eventual bad review, would you book a holiday without checking out the hotel on tripadvisor?

Umesh why don't you cancel if you cant make it work for you? sick of these posts. Yes its expensive - yes there are loads of cheaper wannabes out there that deliver jack - its expensive because it works, it sells me cars. tried findand fund myself and got zip to show for it. so lets look at the sums Motors - Cost £480 pm - 30 cars advertised - 3 emails, no sales in 6 months Findandfundmycar - Cost £245 pm - 30 cars advertised no enquiries no sales in 2 months AutoTrader - Cost £2593 pm - 30 cars advertised - 57 phone calls, 19 calls from mobile app, 17 emails, 7 part ex leads (no deals) 4 finance leads (2 deals done) 22 direct sales - LAST MONTH! So which is the most expensive Umesh? or go and try Jim Reids Autovolo - that worked a treat didn't it? http://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/jim-reid-named-head-autovolo-dealer-council/119857 If it doesn't work cancel, if it works why are you complaining about? stop whinging and stop spreading scare stories and can someone paste this onto the IMDA forum please?

No just promised the earth and said they'd be generating more sales than the autotrader in 12 months, said they'd be spending £25m on advertising this year which I find hard to believe but really thought a big name like them might be able to make a dent in the market. I know that some of the larger supermarkets get it free so they can get a lot of stock on. So basically you and me are subsidising Carshop, Motorpoint etc through our £7 per car