Sold the car on eBay auction customer wants refund

[Golfather76 0]

Hi All 

need your advise please, I sold the car on eBay auction i honestly advertise my car best of my knowledge & even mentioned dent on front wing.

I also said to come drive & inspect the car before bidding  or ask any questions. 13 year old car bound to have some cosmetic issues so I forgot to mentioned minor stone chip rust spots by the front wings but nothing major.

guy won the car in auction & contacted me to pay the deposit which I said no it’s fine you can pay all when you come for collection & I’ll pick you up from train station, I went to pick the guy from station &  gave him a car to drive I took him to my home address where I trade from & asked him to inspect the car before he set off. 

first he couldn’t see the dent I mentioned in the auction & he said oh this is minor then he saw the rust spots which he said my local paint shop will sort this out with the dent. He loved the car & filled the V5 & paid me cash & gone happy. 

Once he reached home he left a positive feedback saying
“slight rust on both wings but not too bad good service”

In the mean time I transferred the car on his name online, next morning around 5:00 in the morning I’m receiving message from him I don’t like the car I took it to my local garage he is asking £1500 for fix it, your car got extensive rust underneath I want my full refund.

now I’m totally confused that who the hell charge £1500 for paint 2 wings & I know my cars the car don’t have any rust underneath. 

no idea which garage he gone to at night to get this quote, so I said No sorry no refund as you came to collect the car & saw the rust spots & it’s not extensive as you mentioning it. After that He was sending aggressive emails all day threatening me to take me to court & i am only an hour away from him, then he tried to send me another quote for £790 & asked me to pay some money towards the paint job. Now I was 100% sure the guy trying to scam me  & want him to pay for the paint job. 
 

he sent me another email last Sunday that he is returning my car & he asked someone to leave the keys & books in the boot, if I’m not available. so I responded  to that, the car is yours you are the legal owner of the car & I’m still waiting to hear from your solicitor, I will not take any responsibility if the car get damaged or clapped as it be on private property & I will let police know  About this, as I’m not allowed to drive or touch your car.
Since then I haven’t heard nothing from him & he didn’t drop the car off. 
 

Sorry for such a long story but my question is where do I stand on this as a trader?  do I have any leg to stand on this & fight back if he takes me to court ?  I want to be fair trader & that’s why i didn’t touch his money just in case I’m in the wrong. 

Thank you for your help & guidance 

 

 

Edited October 30, 2020 by Golfather76
Add a word

[MarkTVS 209]

Were you open and honest selling as a trader? 
Did you sell the car with a fresh mot? If so then is any of the rust structural?

[It's me 615]

oldest trick he bought car either to trade on or he can't afford it or he scams as a living

whatever you decide to do you need to learn from this experience

ie new mot, a proper inspection sheet and a proper receipt at pos

I've given up ive never sold a car on auction successfully on a site like ebay

its not worth the hassle ferromagnetic spellchecker I'm leaving this one start to finish

crush the thing if you think its a heap

lifes too short for chancers who hold grudges and know where you live

Edited October 30, 2020 by It's me

[BHM 994]

[justina3 518]

What does the garages estimate say ? Any mention of surface corrosion on previous mot’s 

it’s how you deal with these people makes all the difference instead of saying get lost just say I am very sorry and somewhat confused the car in my expert opinion was spot on but I am happy to look at the garages detailed report and we can go from there, I might need a second opinion in a garage I use but we will cross that bridge later. 
 

nine times out of ten there in the wind. 

[Frank Cannon 812]

To the OP:

1/ New MOT at sale? 

2/ PDI done? 

3/ What do your invoice terms and conditions state regarding returns/problems/repairs? 

[Golfather76 0]

Hi all

Thank you for your feedback & replies

Car had 5 months MOT, no mention of rust on MOT ,I personally checked the car underneath on the ramp when came in stock usual corrosion like every 2007 Audi A4 have. 

 buyer just came up with the figure of £1500 in his dreams & send me a message 5:00 in the Morning then that price gone down to £790 in few hours. 
yes I should have given him fresh MOT.

lesson learnt for future.

I was more then happy to take the car back With any mechanical problems straight away. But he  was aggressive & trying to scam me.

I was checking his previous emails when the auction starts he offered me £2100 for the car so I guess this was his way to get a discount!! 

 

 

[Frank Cannon 812]

...you sold a retail car with 5 months MOT, quality car 'trader' then

Edited October 31, 2020 by Frank Cannon

[Mistermuttley 19]

On 10/31/2020 at 12:19 PM, Frank Cannon said:

...you sold a retail car with 5 months MOT, quality car 'trader' then

I put a fresh Mot on 'nearly' every car i sell ,but if it has say 9 months+ I am now not bothering. Just giving it a test drive and doing the checks mot would, lights etc. A Pdi covers most safety aspects for a car, so am I in the minority for doing this? The reason i don't do an Mot for car with 9+ months is my garage asking me why I am bothering  to get one done!

[Frank Cannon 812]

Why are you bothering....

Without the car going on a ramp, I can't see how you can offer a PDI but, I do appreciate we are all different. 

[Mistermuttley 19]

U need ramps for a pdi?! Yes we are all different!

[Frank Cannon 812]

Err yes, how else could you do a PDI enlighten me, I'm all ears and hate doing unnecessary work.

And a new MOT on every car regardless is simply sound practice for both vendor and buyer. 

[Mistermuttley 19]

9 minutes ago, Frank Cannon said:

Err yes, how else could you do a PDI enlighten me, I'm all ears and hate doing unnecessary work.

And a new MOT on every car regardless is simply sound practice for both vendor and buyer. 

My PDI is obviously more basic than yours, as I deal with 1k to 4k motors generally, any prep costs soon take whatever profit you have in it away.

My Pdi . For me it covers what I need it to.

I agree re the Mot ,but after the garage I use think I am a bit over the top getting a new Mot when it has say 9+ months I am deciding not to bother with them. If anything goes wrong then its on me. The customers get 3 months warranty anyway so it will just be a financial learning curve for me at that point!

[It's me 615]

1 hour ago, Mistermuttley said:

My PDI is obviously more basic than yours, as I deal with 1k to 4k motors generally, any prep costs soon take whatever profit you have in it away.

My Pdi . For me it covers what I need it to.

I agree re the Mot ,but after the garage I use think I am a bit over the top getting a new Mot when it has say 9+ months I am deciding not to bother with them. If anything goes wrong then its on me. The customers get 3 months warranty anyway so it will just be a financial learning curve for me at that point!

ignore the garage you do the mot to prove due diligence if something goes wrong

think

fatal Road crash

dvsa roadside inspection

small claims court

as adealer you are expected to know the job and so doing a fresh mot shows you are confirming the car was roadworthy on the day you sold it,this is why many of us do a fresh mot on deposit if we think the car is going to be around a while

surely you've bought cars and seen thingsthat make you think its had a poor or dodgy test on it? the classic one is low pads as mot man cannot always see them but a proper pdi would

you really need to cost this in and use it as aselling point

I really hope that helps you

it did me ,in court

 

[Mistermuttley 19]

23 minutes ago, It's me said:

ignore the garage you do the mot to prove due diligence if something goes wrong

think

fatal Road crash

dvsa roadside inspection

small claims court

as adealer you are expected to know the job and so doing a fresh mot shows you are confirming the car was roadworthy on the day you sold it,this is why many of us do a fresh mot on deposit if we think the car is going to be around a while

surely you've bought cars and seen thingsthat make you think its had a poor or dodgy test on it? the classic one is low pads as mot man cannot always see them but a proper pdi would

you really need to cost this in and use it as aselling point

I really hope that helps you

it did me ,in court

 

All good points. Especially re the court! Good to hear other peoples views on pdi's n Mot's.

[petrol head 46]

I think the people spending a grand have higher expectations than those spending £10K. 

[Frank Cannon 812]

12 hours ago, petrol head said:

I think the people spending a grand have higher expectations than those spending £10K. 

Yup

14 hours ago, Mistermuttley said:

My PDI is obviously more basic than yours, as I deal with 1k to 4k motors generally, any prep costs soon take whatever profit you have in it away.

My Pdi . For me it covers what I need it to.

Looks like something that Flipping Cars would knock out.

Do yourself a favour, protect both yourself, your business and your customers, invest in a new MOT and a proper PDI check sheet for EVERY CAR, regardless of cost.....£500 shitter to 50k curtain twitcher. 

The MOT will cover all of the dirty bits under the car, the rest is easy to do. 

The Lawgistics PDI, whilst not flawless, is a very thorough product. 

[David Horgan 564]

On 11/13/2020 at 12:05 PM, Mistermuttley said:

U need ramps for a pdi?! Yes we are all different!

Without a ramp , how do you check ,Bushes ,Steering joints ,  arms , links ,Brake pipes , oil/water  leaks , inside face of brake discs , exhaust leaks , exhaust mountings , springs , tyre side walls , cracks etc .signs of being bent twisted out of line or corrosion in older cars ,   just to list a few bits you cant see from the floor . 

we all might be different but cars are the same 

[Kes 7]

1 hour ago, David Horgan said:

Without a ramp , how do you check ,Bushes ,Steering joints ,  arms , links ,Brake pipes , oil/water  leaks , inside face of brake discs , exhaust leaks , exhaust mountings , springs , tyre side walls , cracks etc .signs of being bent twisted out of line or corrosion in older cars ,   just to list a few bits you cant see from the floor . 

we all might be different but cars are the same 

All these things supposed to be checked on MOT anyway?  And as a doorstepper I don't see a problem checking discs/pads/springs/brake hoses/cv joint gaiters/tyres by using simple 30£ jack. 

 

[MarkTVS 209]

11 minutes ago, Kes said:

All these things supposed to be checked on MOT anyway?  And as a doorstepper I don't see a problem checking discs/pads/springs/brake hoses/cv joint gaiters/tyres by using simple 30£ jack. 

 

I don’t think you should be doing pdi’s at all unless your a competent mechanic. An mot is a minimum standard which we as motor trade should not be selling cars at. We should be selling cars at least part of the way between mot standard and service standard.

[Kes 7]

So even if I sort out all advisories on the MOT and give it fresh service it is still not up to motor trade standards? And I'm talking about sub 2k stuff.

The point I was trying to make was that it is all about knowledge and right attitude and you still can do things right without ramp, workshop, team of f1 mechanics etc.

[MarkTVS 209]

35 minutes ago, Kes said:

So even if I sort out all advisories on the MOT and give it fresh service it is still not up to motor trade standards? And I'm talking about sub 2k stuff.

The point I was trying to make was that it is all about knowledge and right attitude and you still can do things right without ramp, workshop, team of f1 mechanics etc.

Yes you can do it on the deck I don’t doubt that, but it makes the job ten times harder, unless your jack is really really high it would be hard to get the space to get a lever in to check play in rear axle bushes, front suspension arms. You struggle to get the angle on your arms to check for play in droplinks etc. 

[Kes 7]

13 minutes ago, MarkTVS said:

Yes you can do it on the deck I don’t doubt that, but it makes the job ten times harder, unless your jack is really really high it would be hard to get the space to get a lever in to check play in rear axle bushes, front suspension arms. You struggle to get the angle on your arms to check for play in droplinks etc. 

Yep, it is harder and more time consuming. No way I would do it on a pitch with 20 cars.

[Martin F 15]

Guys, I don’t want to teach anybody to suck eggs, but you should NEVER work under a car that is supported only by a jack. You should ALWAYS be using axle stands or similar support.

Won’t get into the debate about competency or comprehensiveness but just wanted to make sure the obvious safety point wasn’t overlooked  

[Kes 7]

14 minutes ago, Martin F said:

Guys, I don’t want to teach anybody to suck eggs, but you should NEVER work under a car that is supported only by a jack. You should ALWAYS be using axle stands or similar support.

Won’t get into the debate about competency or comprehensiveness but just wanted to make sure the obvious safety point wasn’t overlooked  

Of course. Just forgot to mention. I always use axle stands.