Stolen Credit Card to Purchase car over Phone

[Funny Farm 7]

Hi, 

I have just had a letter from my card terminal supplier that a car I sold on August 1st for £7750 was paid for by a stolen credit card. This guy "Dean Talbot" Heywood Lancs had bought a car a month before from us with a credit card with correct name, address which matched the Photo Licence details he sent me by email.

I have had no comeback from this car however the 2nd car he bought was his "business credit card". He is now non contactable and I have reported the car stolen.

My question is, am I protected from this kind of fraud, why didn't the bank freeze or check the payment with the card holder? the credit card company insist it is my liability, however why are we not protected from this kind of fraud..

I have contacted the police and reported the vehicle stolen. But I am obviously naive to this kind of scam.

 

[mike101 8]

Chip and pin or card details over the phone?

[stockedup! 63]

16 minutes ago, Funny Farm said:

Hi, 

I have just had a letter from my card terminal supplier that a car I sold on August 1st for £7750 was paid for by a stolen credit card. This guy "Dean Talbot" Heywood Lancs had bought a car a month before from us with a credit card with correct name, address which matched the Photo Licence details he sent me by email.

I have had no comeback from this car however the 2nd car he bought was his "business credit card". He is now non contactable and I have reported the car stolen.

My question is, am I protected from this kind of fraud, why didn't the bank freeze or check the payment with the card holder? the credit card company insist it is my liability, however why are we not protected from this kind of fraud..

I have contacted the police and reported the vehicle stolen. But I am obviously naive to this kind of scam.

 

Unfortunately if a card is stolen or fraudulent, even if they type the number into the machine by way of chip and pin, you may still have the money taken back. The card company should look into this to make sure the punter isn't trying to scam you by saying the car was stolen/fraudulent when it wasn't.

[Stalker 180]

Did you deliver the car to the matched address with the credit card? 

Did the customer sign paperwork on delivery and look like the photo ID provided? 

 

 

[J.T 39]

Hi Funny,

probably best not to name him on a public forum as he could be completely innocent and also a victim of the fraud? 

I'm sorry to hear you've been a victim of fraud, it's a real kicker if you're going to lose that amount. I know how hard these credit card companies are to deal with too.

Why would you take that amount over the phone though, surely that's taking a massive risk? Call me old fashioned but I only take £200 deposits by phone, and that's only if they've been and viewed the vehicle and have gone away to think about it. 

 

[Funny Farm 7]

Hi, 

Thanks for your replies. The guy bought 2 cars from me. The first I ensured he forwarded me his Driving licence. The car was delivered to his address by car delivery company (they have also had a chargeback for stolen credit card). The guy was waiting outside the house so probably wasn't his house according to the delivery driver. 2 months later he buys the 2nd car which is with a stolen credit card which he said was in his name but at his business address. Because the first car sale went ok, I was happy to trust the 2nd one would too. You could even here his kids playing in the background when calling him.

Because I've lost the vehicle and have to pay back the £7750 I've had a double whammy (£15500 loss). I'm obviously gutted and it couldn't have come at a worse time, Tax Bill, VAT bill, and this have stripped me of 40% of my stock value. With cars not selling at the moment I have to seriously consider my future, but also learn the lessons from it. The car has probably been sold on to an innocent victim but it is now on the stolen list, my question is, if the car is found can I get it back?

[Stalker 180]

Just now, C B said:

Not wanting to rub salt into the wound but £7,750.00 over the phone????? 

Only take over the phone what you can afford to lose. 

And you haven't lost £15,500.00!! In total you've lost £7,750.00. Still not great but not as bad as you're telling yourself. You could even argue that your  actual loss is the SIV of the sold car, £6k maybe? 

Chin up, move forward and in a few years time it'l be just a story to tell. 

Read it again, he’s sold him two cars 

I presume both cars were £7750?

[Stalker 180]

1 minute ago, C B said:

I don't need to read it again. 

The 1st sale has had no comeback. 

He's calculating his loss with £7,750.00 car that has gone and the £7,750.00 payment which is being clawed back. 

My bad, sorry.

i just read it again. 

Yes I agree your loss is £7750 plus the aggro. 

Are you in the clear on the first transaction, I’d be digging out the paperwork and making some calls. 

What address did you put the V5 in? 

[Rory RSC 596]

Trust no one. Never take a card payment over the phone for any amount greater than you are prepared to write off. 

[mike101 8]

8 minutes ago, Rory RSC said:

Trust no one. Never take a card payment over the phone for any amount greater than you are prepared to write off. 

+1 - I missed the over the phone title yesterday. Hard lesson for you for sure. 

[James01 21]

1 hour ago, Stalker said:

My bad, sorry.

i just read it again. 

Yes I agree your loss is £7750 plus the aggro. 

Are you in the clear on the first transaction, I’d be digging out the paperwork and making some calls. 

What address did you put the V5 in? 

I was just thinking the same thing. It’s either a big mix up or both transactions would have likely been moody.

The person would not have bought the first car legitimately with his card and details and then bought a second one using stolen card unless they are extremely stupid. 

A local dealer to us nearly got taken for £40k on a bmw M4 with the same trick. Luckily the police recovered the car! 

[stockedup! 63]

I was always led to believe that as long as they use the chip and pin your money was safe but this simply isn't the case. If it turns out that a card has been fraudulently used they will come back for the money from you and there isn't a time limit on it, this is even if they come and use the chip and pin!! You just have to be so careful nowadays, we ain't selling small value items.  I know it is a chew but get proofs off people and a photo of them at your premises if you can. The card company are obliged to fight your corner but will only do so if you can provide due diligence. 

 

[Mikey360 68]

I had the exact same person (Dean Talbot) try it on with me earlier in the year with an Audi A3, wanted it delivered, wanted to pay by credit card, wouldn't have it driven to him. Claimed he was in Preston, tried a couple of times with different postcodes. 

Wouldn't pay unless he could do it over the phone via credit Card. He's clearly a scammer! 

Edited September 13, 2019 by Mikey360

[justina3 518]

4 hours ago, Stalker said:

My bad, sorry.

i just read it again. 

Yes I agree your loss is £7750 plus the aggro. 

Are you in the clear on the first transaction, I’d be digging out the paperwork and making some calls. 

What address did you put the V5 in? 

wouldnt the loss be the original price of the car paid upon purchase then the claw backed amount later so would be more than £7750, 

[Stalker 180]

25 minutes ago, justina3 said:

wouldnt the loss be the original price of the car paid upon purchase then the claw backed amount later so would be more than £7750, 

No it’s just the theft of the cost of the product. 

The £7750 is the amount recieved that is being clawed back. 

[beenaroundtheblock 21]

It's only the cost if the vehicle in question, you cannot count the money from the credit card as it was not yours in the first place. Chances are the car is already abroad somewhere with no hope of recovery. 

Have you checked it's showing as insured? If so it may still be over here. 

[Stalker 180]

2 minutes ago, C B said:

The loss is the SIV of the car. 

Nothing more, nothing less.

Plus costs

[justina3 518]

3 hours ago, Stalker said:

No it’s just the theft of the cost of the product. 

The £7750 is the amount recieved that is being clawed back. 

blonde moment has passed well not really blonde thats the shine from my head but same effect sometimes.

[Boycie 30]

The last place I worked for had the same thing, first car delivered, guy waiting outside the house, driver didn't check anything, easy.  As he was a good customer, he rang up and tried to pay over the phone for a 2nd car, but they refused to accept payment unless he came in. It's the delay in finding out the 1st payment is moody that often leads to a 2nd pop at it.  As everyone says, no card payments!!!!

[Funny Farm 7]

Cheers Guys. Yes he will surface again. So if anyone who hears from Dean Talbot can go along with it but call the police. It may help in recovering the car. I'm gutted, but also wiser. I have another car over the phone too. Similar area, Peter Orr {Im assuming Stolen ID too}.. These people need catching!!

[Funny Farm 7]

Unfortunately this deal was done 2 months back. No chargeback yet. They give you 120 days for a credit card holder to dispute a payment (Chargeback) after that the money is safe. What ever way you look at it, there's always a victim. 

[MattR 177]

A tough lesson to learn. I doubt it will get you anywhere but is it worth checking if your trade policy has any protection regarding fraud?

It will also be peanuts in comparison, but I would be harrassing your credit card machine providers. I bet they've still charged you the percentage of the 7750 for processing the transaction....

[David Horgan 564]

If you took £7,750 over the phone you will lose the lot if its a stolen card . 

If he paid chip and pin on the card at your premises your safe . Its what the pin number is for , shows customer contact . 

its that simple really .

Only take the amount of money on the phone that you are prepared to lose was what I was always told . 

had two old dears once try and buy a Megane R26 once and wanted to pay on the phone , i took the details of the card but didn't take the money and reported it , it was a stolen card in the end . 

I feel for you if you do lose the £7,750 and the car of course , 

 

[Casper 272]

1 hour ago, David Horgan said:

If you took £7,750 over the phone you will lose the lot if its a stolen card . 

If he paid chip and pin on the card at your premises your safe . Its what the pin number is for , shows customer contact . 

its that simple really .

Only take the amount of money on the phone that you are prepared to lose was what I was always told . 

had two old dears once try and buy a Megane R26 once and wanted to pay on the phone , i took the details of the card but didn't take the money and reported it , it was a stolen card in the end . 

I feel for you if you do lose the £7,750 and the car of course , 

 

yes terrible people out there  in future id recommend considering only taking deposit over the phone hope it gets sorted keep us posted

good luck    

Edited September 14, 2019 by Casper

[David Horgan 564]

12 minutes ago, Casper said:

id recommend considering only taking deposit over the phone

£50  is all I will take on the phone Casper . just shows commitment from customer, Come and see it and then leave the other £450 on Chip & Pin  is my rule .