EPV 631 Posted July 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, Stalker said: Does it have a freewheeling pulley on the alternator? We have had these not drive the alternator and then give out a low charge, can you get the fault to happen? What is the battery voltage before and after the fault occurs? To be fair mate I haven't had the chance to get those readings, if the battery doesn't sort it then I think I'll delve into getting those readings Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mark101 536 Posted July 10, 2018 Before reading all this I though poor battery and that would be my first port of call. An OEM quality battery rated correctly for that car, then get the ECU read and codes cleared. Only from my experience or lessons learned (caveat: I have no mechanical or electrical skill) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 10, 2018 3 hours ago, EPV said: Update; no fault codes present but it transpires that the battery fitted is 90ah and the system is set up for a 110ah battery. It’s probable the alternator is effectively overcharging the incorrect battery and causing the electrical gremlins. Hopefully the correct battery will resolve this. What machine did you use to read the Codes ?? I find it difficult to believe that there is nothing there, when all those Sub Systems have put lights on on the dash. What I said earlier, this sort of Fault needs to go on ISTA, even a decent Generic will likely not see this problem, and OBD2 readers forget it Also record a Data Log of Voltages when driving, A new Battery is a good first call, but I think that is unlikely in this case, more likely to be Alternator related Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EPV 631 Posted July 10, 2018 3 hours ago, Dave2302 said: What machine did you use to read the Codes ?? I find it difficult to believe that there is nothing there, when all those Sub Systems have put lights on on the dash. What I said earlier, this sort of Fault needs to go on ISTA, even a decent Generic will likely not see this problem, and OBD2 readers forget it Also record a Data Log of Voltages when driving, A new Battery is a good first call, but I think that is unlikely in this case, more likely to be Alternator related Cheers for your help mate 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) Thank You, that is what a Forum is all about............... helping. This stuff is the core of my Business, whether it is recommendations from local Garages who don't have the Dealer Level machines and knowledge, word of mouth from locals, and also increasingly, I buy cars with these sort of problems for rock bottom, then fix 'em and retail 'em I have never advertised up here, a good and thorough job and word of mouth works fine I am fortunate, I'm in the enviable position that the only other option my Customer base have is a 120 to 260 mile round trip to Inverness Main Stealers, and then they've got to leave the Car and get home, then go back when it's done, then have hassle when it isn't actually fixed, but they've been fleeced for a load of parts they didn't need etc etc Believe it or not, I now get Mercedes Main Dealer Workshops who I buy from phoning for advice on some problems, usually OM651 Engines Cheers Dave Edited July 11, 2018 by Dave2302 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EPV 631 Posted July 11, 2018 20 minutes ago, Dave2302 said: Thank You, that is what a Forum is all about............... helping. This stuff is the core of my Business, whether it is recommendations from local Garages who don't have the Dealer Level machines and knowledge, word of mouth from locals, and also increasingly, I buy cars with these sort of problems for rock bottom, then fix 'em and retail 'em I have never advertised up here, a good and thorough job and word of mouth works fine I am fortunate, I'm in the enviable position that the only other option my Customer base have is a 120 to 260 mile round trip to Inverness Main Stealers, and then they've got to leave the Car and get home, then go back when it's done, then have hassle when it isn't actually fixed, but they've been fleeced for a load of parts they didn't need etc etc Believe it or not, I now get Mercedes Main Dealer Workshops who I buy from phoning for advice on some problems, usually OM651 Engines Cheers Dave I have one of those currently, a 2014 C250 CDI Touch wood there's nowt wrong with it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) They are a brilliant Engine, just an absolute b@st*rd to correctly diagnose when they go wrong, but I have SDS old and new plus i actually know how they work Like any MB, don't guess and chuck parts at it, well same goes for anything modern really lol, but more so on the 'Hermans' One of my Fleet owners has one, in his personal E250 Wagon, that has 220k miles on it, had a major melt down last year, sensors solenoids and blocked DPF, but part of that was because he kept driving it with EML on and it blocked DPF, buggered a load of expensive sensors, like £400 Lambda, EGT etc etc. Causal Part was a £80 Actuator Solenoid My advice, if EML comes on, don't drive it, get it fixed, because like most modern Diesels, a simple Fault Code can and will prevent the DPF from Re-Generating. Good thing about MB's is, unlike VAG, they will allow you to do a successful forced Re-Gen once you have got the original Fault fixed Our own personal Diesel MB's have OM646 in them, not quite as powerful, but even I get 48mpg outta the C Class with "lead foot", my Petrol V8 Supercharged MB, I've had that down to 8mpg Edited July 11, 2018 by Dave2302 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twerp 69 Posted July 11, 2018 I often notice OM651 powered cars go for a song because of DPF related codes. Hmmm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) If your near me bring 'em in, if not get a good local Indie with SDS, but buy 'em for buttons, then spend a few $$ and sell for top dollar That's how I got into Selling again up here, you gotta be brutal, but can make a good buck for a little effort Oh, BTW, 2017 and above E Class, (and C & S), in a couple of years these will be going for pennies, because when all the Audio / Telematics / Cloud systems go wrong they will be un fixable to the majority When fixed good return I can't wait Edited July 11, 2018 by Dave2302 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nick M.K. 574 Posted July 11, 2018 35 minutes ago, Dave2302 said: Our own personal Diesel MB's have OM646 in them Best car I owned, a 2007 CLK220 CDI, bought in 2012 at 175K miles for around £3900, sold in 2016 at 251K miles for £3500 (and it was a very quick sale). The biggest thing it needed replacing other than tyres and brakes was a split boost pipe, around £60. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) /\ /\ /\ and properly looked after it will do another 100k miles. That C Class i have had 120k on it when I got it 13 months ago, now has 160k due to all the trips south for the Ill rellies. When I got it I did Brakes all round, 2 Tyres, Full Service, Aux Belt and fixed the Turbo Actuator. It passed MOT with flying colours. Last month, 1 year on, Brakes are still like new, (cos I fit em properly and don't skimp, don't bash new Pads into Carriers with a hammer, Coppaslip etc etc). So, I gave it a thorough checking over, fitted a new Sidelight Bulb to a dull one, Oil and all Filters and it again passed MOT with no advises........... Sorry, not "Advises", "Minor Faults" now Edited July 11, 2018 by Dave2302 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 180 Posted July 11, 2018 4 hours ago, Dave2302 said: Believe it or not, I now get Mercedes Main Dealer Workshops who I buy from phoning for advice on some problems, usually OM651 Engines I hate these engines with a passion. The tightest engine bay ever on the egr side! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) /\ /\ /\ Like Yeah and guess where the Boost and Waterpump etc Controller Solenoids are ?? These are PWM Solenoid valves, and you have to remove EGR etc to get to them, one EGR bolt is a right PITA even with a 1/4 drive Snap On ETorx on a UJ, 3/8 stuff is too big to get in there You can do the one Solenoid at the back from underneath but expect skinned knuckles lol. There are 2 more Sols under the Glow Controller at the front, so it is important to know exactly which ones are giving grief, I change all the ones under EGR area even if only 1 of them is Faulty, a few quid extra on parts saves a ton of labour and hassle when another one goes a month later Oh also, the Vac operated Cooling Water Pump is hellish dear and gives problems around 170k miles + The Timing Chains, and HP Fuel Pump etc is all on the Flywheel end on OM651, unlike the OM646 which was nice and easy at the front Edited July 11, 2018 by Dave2302 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 180 Posted July 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Dave2302 said: /\ /\ /\ Like Yeah and guess where the Boost and Waterpump etc Controller Solenoids are ?? These are PWM Solenoid valves, and you have to remove EGR etc to get to them, one EGR bolt is a right PITA even with a 1/4 drive Snap On ETorx on a UJ, 3/8 stuff is too big to get in there You can do the one Solenoid at the back from underneath but expect skinned knuckles lol. There are 2 more Sols under the Glow Controller at the front, so it is important to know exactly which ones are giving grief, I change all the ones under EGR area even if only 1 of them is Faulty, a few quid extra on parts saves a ton of labour and hassle when another one goes a month later Oh also, the Vac operated Cooling Water Pump is hellish dear and gives problems around 170k miles + The Timing Chains, and HP Fuel Pump etc is all on the Flywheel end on OM651, unlike the OM646 which was nice and easy at the front We have a CLA with the OM651 engine that s being a pain in the arse on the DPF side! Its a low mileage one we sold too! I think i have found the culprit.... a loose jubilee clip on the pipe to the MAF. Probably not tightened at its last air filter change. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 Hi, yes could well be, an Airflow code will prevent regen. Fix leak, Clear both sets of codes, Current and Stored, then do a forced regen, followed by a long test drive. Some of these will not allow forced regen, you have to drive it, and it has to be between certain road speeds etc, which annoys anyone following you at 30 mph I wouldn't trust any other Diag than SDS to do this job, if it doesn't regen it can end up fubar a load of expensive sensors, even if it does drive ok at the time !! HTH, Cheers Dave Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 180 Posted July 11, 2018 47 minutes ago, Dave2302 said: Hi, yes could well be, an Airflow code will prevent regen. Fix leak, Clear both sets of codes, Current and Stored, then do a forced regen, followed by a long test drive. Some of these will not allow forced regen, you have to drive it, and it has to be between certain road speeds etc, which annoys anyone following you at 30 mph I wouldn't trust any other Diag than SDS to do this job, if it doesn't regen it can end up fubar a load of expensive sensors, even if it does drive ok at the time !! HTH, Cheers Dave It appears to have two pressure sensors! Never seen this before,one of the pipes from the dpf tees off to another sensor that then differentiates between the dpf pressure and the inlet manifold? Sorry EPV by the way.... We are awaiting more info from you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EPV 631 Posted July 11, 2018 Battery replaced, followed by a 20 mile drive mostly motorways, driven to 6,000 rpm, plenty of kickdowns and not a single issue. I'll do the same again tomorrow before handing back to the customer and hoping that it's done the trick. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dave2302 387 Posted July 11, 2018 (edited) EPV, that's great news, did you do a heavy discharge test on the old Battery, I suspect that not only was it low A/hr but also probably losing it's Capacity Stalker, OM651 monitors more Air Flow EGR Flow and Back Pressures in that way than the older OM646, but as long as there aren't any unseen Codes left, it should do a forced re gen, either stationary or driving depending on exact Car. Stationary is a lot easier if ECU will allow you to do it If there is lingering Codes you will need a look at "Actual Values" (Live Data) and do some "Actuations" before you can conclude exactly what is causing the Code(s) preventing Re gen, and even then it can take a couple of goes to nail it completely !! I usually get these 1st or 2nd go max.............. Having done a load of them now, I think what is happening is I look at it all and find what is the last part to fail, cure that and then a second further diagnostic finds the original first failed part that actually caused the whole disaster lol !! No 2 Cars are the same fault parts wise either, a lot of different bits can cause the DPF levels to rise and no Regen Another little tip, OM651's are very sensitive to some "Pattern" Air Filters, even decent ones like Fram, WIX etc, so I always buy filters for these from MB, they aren't that expensive and give a lot less hassle............ Ask me some time how I know that I have to say though, SDS machine is really the only way to work on MB's nowadays, mind, it is starting to apply to many other Mfrs too, hence all the dosh I've spent this last year Cheers Dave Edited July 11, 2018 by Dave2302 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BHM 994 Posted July 11, 2018 Fuck me, I fell asleep reading this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
It's me 612 Posted July 11, 2018 5 minutes ago, BHM said: Fuck me, I fell asleep reading this. well it is late and we did lose Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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