Vat registration margin scheme

[Grantlfc81 88]

When do I have to register for the vat margins scheme. Is it after I sell £80k of cars in a 12 month period or is it after I make £80k profit in a 12 month period?

[Tom 164]

Its based on turnover so once you hit the threshold you register for VAT. You can also wind back a few months and claim back some old vat receipts. 

[Grantlfc81 88]

So after I sell £80k of cars. Rediculous lol

[trade vet 702]

23 minutes ago, Grantlfc81 said:

So after I sell £80k of cars. Rediculous lol

Excuse me Grant,but did you not say that you had been in the trade before ?

[Arfur Dealy 823]

Grant, 80k turnover is nothing, if you think you will easily exceed it you should register for VAT straight away. 

[Tom 164]

1 hour ago, Grantlfc81 said:

So after I sell £80k of cars. Rediculous lol

You can register BEFORE if you want,but HAVE to after the threshold. 

[Grantlfc81 88]

Yes I've been in the trade before. But along time ago. 14 years ago in fact. I will easily exceed £80k in turnover. I just didn't know if it was in fact £80k in profit before I needed to register. 

[trade vet 702]

1 hour ago, Grantlfc81 said:

Yes I've been in the trade before. But along time ago. 14 years ago in fact. I will easily exceed £80k in turnover. I just didn't know if it was in fact £80k in profit before I needed to register. 

The threshold was £55k then ! The basic rules have not changed. You will get a lot of ( free)help from the pros on here,but I think we need to know what you did previously ‘in the trade’.You had given me the impression that you had previously been a retailer but you appear like a new starter to me- but that is OK.

[Arfur Dealy 823]

Btw it’s 85k

[Grantlfc81 88]

1 hour ago, trade vet said:

The threshold was £55k then ! The basic rules have not changed. You will get a lot of ( free)help from the pros on here,but I think we need to know what you did previously ‘in the trade’.You had given me the impression that you had previously been a retailer but you appear like a new starter to me- but that is OK.

I worked at Dagenham motors for 4 years and toomey motors for 2 years.

ive run and owned multiple companies in that time but never Moved back into the motor trade. 

Its only the odd question I'm firing out here and there and I'll be on my way. Thanks for all your kind answers

Edited December 26, 2017 by Grantlfc81

[trade vet 702]

1 hour ago, Grantlfc81 said:

I worked at Dagenham motors for 4 years and toomey motors for 2 years.

ive run and owned multiple companies in that time but never Moved back into the motor trade. 

Its only the odd question I'm firing out here and there and I'll be on my way. Thanks for all your kind answers

So you are a new starter as a motor trader.....welcome to the jungle ! Just keep asking about stuff on here and you will get plenty of good advice.

[Max Branning 149]

The VAT threshold will more than likely be reduced come 2020. There was talks of getting it in line with the rest of Europe, in Germany i think its around 10k.

 

 

[Grantlfc81 88]

I can't see that, maybe in the car industry, but not across the board. Plumbers and electricians etc would suffer tremendously - also the general public would be paying 20% more for there house to be worked on.

[Arfur Dealy 823]

18 minutes ago, Max Branning said:

The VAT threshold will more than likely be reduced come 2020. There was talks of getting it in line with the rest of Europe, in Germany i think its around 10k.

 

 

I also can’t see that, with Brexit looming  this country needs to attract investment by business and business needs long term stability. 

[Max Branning 149]

14 hours ago, Grantlfc81 said:

I can't see that, maybe in the car industry, but not across the board. Plumbers and electricians etc would suffer tremendously - also the general public would be paying 20% more for there house to be worked on.

Unfortunately the country is broke and the government need to get some money in.

Britain has the highest VAT threshold in Europe and there were rumours it would be reduced. In the Netherlands it is around only 1k to be registered.

How many car dealers / builders / plumbers keep their books just under the threshold of £85k to avoid being registered ?

It would be an excellent money maker for the government to reduce the threshold whether we like it or not.

Look at what has happened in the private rental sector with landlord taxation. Totally unbelievable but the government will make billions, unfortunately there will be a lot of landlords made bankrupt and homelessness will rise.

 

[trade vet 702]

58 minutes ago, tradex said:

Threshold frozen for 18/19 @85k

Rumour we heard was down to 43k....another unenforceable rule.

I've spent a few days looking at cars and motorcycles on gumtree, and as BHM alludes, it would seem that more a few are plastic traders (being polite, rougue traders more applicable)..the 'tradease' wording and tyre shine is  such a giveaway.

It seems to me that it's never been easier to 'do a few'.

So glad we are the downslope and a slow wind down.

I think it is now harder to ‘do a few’ and not declare them compared with bygone days when your local paper had full pages of ‘private ads’.What I don’t like are those ( often of foreign descent)who  set up as a car sales business which is owned by some off the shelf Ltd company,then operate for 18 months,pay little or no PAYE or VAT then dissolve the company.The business then carries on using the same name but is then owned by a new Ltd company etc and supposedly a different person.HMRC apparently do not have the resources to stamp out this sort of thing,so they just make excuses to chase soft targets using creative assessments.....

[Rory RSC 596]

I don't think it is harder to do a few these days. Its easier if anything as requires hardly any effort couple of pics, straight onto facebook / gumtree etc job done.

 

See loads of people thing its easy to make £200 on a car and away they go. All traders until you have a problem then its private sale mate.

[trade vet 702]

1 hour ago, Rory RSC said:

I don't think it is harder to do a few these days. Its easier if anything as requires hardly any effort couple of pics, straight onto facebook / gumtree etc job done.

 

See loads of people thing its easy to make £200 on a car and away they go. All traders until you have a problem then its private sale mate.

Hi Rory

Apoligies in advance for this reply - You are right of course about how easy it is to put stuff on line.But selling has to be harder because of the choice available. It also appears to me that a lot of the punters do not have savings anymore,but only plenty of plastic card debt and the rest.If you could forgive me for harping back to the golden age when punters would rely on their local newspaper,this was how we did it.When I was 17,my friend and I were doorsteppers,we only bought something called an Austin A60 and they were plentyfull and cost about £40.We would sell these instantly for £85 ( providing you could deliver them ).We were one of many doing this,all cash,no comebacks,little prep.We were earning more than top level footballers,lawyers ,doctors and dentists to think of a few......I did warn you !

[Arfur Dealy 823]

TV, it was a bit like that on the early days of ebay, I was there at the start with cars,  it was the first net medium where you could write a proper description and be honest and upfront.... Sixteen years later classified ads is the only way.

[BHM 994]

13 hours ago, Arfur Dealy said:

TV, it was a bit like that on the early days of ebay, I was there at the start with cars,  it was the first net medium where you could write a proper description and be honest and upfront.... Sixteen years later classified ads is the only way.

+1 - classified only is the way to go. It’s been years since ebay auctions were any good, the private men have all had enough of the “spares or repair” game and have wisened up to the “just needs a few quid & a mornings work to get it 100%” . 

It was brutal (for the punters!) - you could sell absolutely any shit, no comebacks, “sold as seen” and the private punters would bid up everything to strong money. The African & Ireland export job was strong AND the Eastern Europeans (EE) had came online and were filling wagons with absolutely any shite they could get their hands on.

I remember one EE exporter phoning me desperate to stop the eBay auction on a knackered (admittedly not advertised as knackered) Discovery that I’d purchased from the block - it stood me at £800 all and then the oil light started flickering (probably due to having about 200K miles on its back and about 8 owners - not my finest purchase ). 

Anyhow I could barely understand a word, I initially thought he was Asian with his “what’s best price” negotiation and jokingly offered him it at “36 pence and a bag of crisps”. Anyhow he said a few times “3, 6” and I just kept saying ok, and then he said “Ok, I give 3, 6, 0, 0, my truck with you this afternoon”. That afternoon a wagon turned up outside my house, the driver couldn’t speak a word of the queen’s, paid up, loaded up and headed off to somewhere near Russia. £2800 profit for an evening at the block & pulling out the oil pressure warning lamp and I knew the heap of shit wouldn’t be coming back for a warranty claim!

At about the same time some idiot ebayer gave me another £2000 profit on a Smart on a Cat. D that looked like the panels had been thrown on by Stevie Wonder - he was chuffed to bits when he collected it cos “I’ve saved £400”, the car was a f***ing pig. Those were certainly the days, look at it now, penniless greedy twats wanting something for nowt, even if it’s got four new tyres, new MOT and a new clutch & flywheel they still want money off and about 5 years warranty. This job’s about f***ed at the moment, with no-one wanting to pay proper money for a proper car, the main reason being they haven’t got proper money, cars aren’t coveted anymore money and their money goes on Sky TV, McDonalds and eating out at shitty chain pubs twice a week - mind you, they don’t drink in pubs anymore, the greedy sods are down Tesco filling trolleys with cheap booze. Happy new year everyone, Roll on 2018! 

[trade vet 702]

1 hour ago, BHM said:

+1 - classified only is the way to go. It’s been years since ebay auctions were any good, the private men have all had enough of the “spares or repair” game and have wisened up to the “just needs a few quid & a mornings work to get it 100%” . 

It was brutal (for the punters!) - you could sell absolutely any shit, no comebacks, “sold as seen” and the private punters would bid up everything to strong money. The African & Ireland export job was strong AND the Eastern Europeans (EE) had came online and were filling wagons with absolutely any shite they could get their hands on.

I remember one EE exporter phoning me desperate to stop the eBay auction on a knackered (admittedly not advertised as knackered) Discovery that I’d purchased from the block - it stood me at £800 all and then the oil light started flickering (probably due to having about 200K miles on its back and about 8 owners - not my finest purchase ). 

Anyhow I could barely understand a word, I initially thought he was Asian with his “what’s best price” negotiation and jokingly offered him it at “36 pence and a bag of crisps”. Anyhow he said a few times “3, 6” and I just kept saying ok, and then he said “Ok, I give 3, 6, 0, 0, my truck with you this afternoon”. That afternoon a wagon turned up outside my house, the driver couldn’t speak a word of the queen’s, paid up, loaded up and headed off to somewhere near Russia. £2800 profit for an evening at the block & pulling out the oil pressure warning lamp and I knew the heap of shit wouldn’t be coming back for a warranty claim!

At about the same time some idiot ebayer gave me another £2000 profit on a Smart on a Cat. D that looked like the panels had been thrown on by Stevie Wonder - he was chuffed to bits when he collected it cos “I’ve saved £400”, the car was a f***ing pig. Those were certainly the days, look at it now, penniless greedy twats wanting something for nowt, even if it’s got four new tyres, new MOT and a new clutch & flywheel they still want money off and about 5 years warranty. This job’s about f***ed at the moment, with no-one wanting to pay proper money for a proper car, the main reason being they haven’t got proper money, cars aren’t coveted anymore money and their money goes on Sky TV, McDonalds and eating out at shitty chain pubs twice a week - mind you, they don’t drink in pubs anymore, the greedy sods are down Tesco filling trolleys with cheap booze. Happy new year everyone, Roll on 2018! 

Wonderfull past glories,I can recall the younger guys at the block with similar stories of huge margins and we just didn’t believe them or had no idea what they were talking about.Years later,we started putting bigger Chinese alloys on German stuff and having accumulated a lot of the originals,our guy decided to try them on eBay.I think we got wagons coming over from Poland to collect them......I see my prediction that trade would be good this week has failed,the 7 day weather forecast wasn’t bad !

[Arfur Dealy 823]

55 minutes ago, trade vet said:

Wonderfull past glories,I can recall the younger guys at the block with similar stories of huge margins and we just didn’t believe them or had no idea what they were talking about.Years later,we started putting bigger Chinese alloys on German stuff and having accumulated a lot of the originals,our guy decided to try them on eBay.I think we got wagons coming over from Poland to collect them......I see my prediction that trade would be good this week has failed,the 7 day weather forecast wasn’t bad !

It’s crazy down hear, I’ve done 7 in the last 8 days

[BHM 994]

Dead here, sales wise. Plenty of emails offering peanuts & phone call idiots asking “Any marks or scratches?” on 8 - 10 year old cars. Apparently my attitude is “Strange” for answering in the positive - I asked her if she’d prefer me to lie and tell her the car is immaculate. 

[trade vet 702]

24 minutes ago, Arfur Dealy said:

It’s crazy down hear, I’ve done 7 in the last 8 days

Arfur,I can sense the groans from those snowed in around the country !

[Dan W 57]

5 hours ago, BHM said:

Dead here, sales wise. Plenty of emails offering peanuts & phone call idiots asking “Any marks or scratches?” on 8 - 10 year old cars. Apparently my attitude is “Strange” for answering in the positive - I asked her if she’d prefer me to lie and tell her the car is immaculate. 

Prob would have preferred you to lie, so people can keep up this image of us sales people being complete basta*ds. Imagine her now going around telling her friends....

well he was far too honest I was offended at the amount of truths he was coming out with !!