RE: Baggott: Vauxhall taking the number one spot? Aldred must be joking

[James Baggott 227]

Vauxhall wasn't too happy about my column this month. But I still stand by what I said.

Do you think Vauxhall could ever take the number one spot from Ford? With the current line up of cars I don't think they ever can - and neither did the dealers I spoke to.

What do you think?

[christhomson 2]

Do I think Vauxhall will overtake Ford in the UK by 2016? Of course not. But I fear you've let some sort of personal issues pervade your writing. You're a good journalist, but you can't let such biases affect what could have otherwise been a more balanced and analytical piece.

You say you can't see any punter spending their own cash on a current Vauxhall model, but more than 200,000 have been sold this year so far and they are not all fleet sales, so what are you saying? That these people are stupid? I don't drive a Vauxhall, but from an outsiders perspective it really is puzzling why there is so much negativity against Vauxhall as a brand.

I know you edit the Nissan Insider website and I can't help but feel that if Nissan's UK MD had said something like this, you'd probably have called it 'brave' or 'ambitious' - and Vauxhall outsells Nissan in the UK two-to-one. Tell me I'm wrong...

[James Baggott 227]

You're wrong 'Chris', but I appreciate your comments. There's no bias here - just a serious concern that Vauxhall is digging itself even deeper into a hole it won't be able to climb out of. MDs can't make such bizarre and outrageous comments and not be called into question.

 

Ask any journalist which they'd buy between a Fiesta and a Corsa and I doubt they'd be many that would suggest the Vauxhall is the one to pick. It's the same with the Kuga, Mondeo, Focus and most of the rest of the respective ranges.

 

There's no doubt Vauxhall sells many cars - where, exactly, is a grey area - but I've certainly seen a fair few rentals around. There's negativity around Vauxhall because their products lack excitement, innovation and they're frankly dull. Dull like clouds: You know they're there, but you don't really notice them.

 

The ridiculously named Adam is probably the only exception.

 

It's true the sister company to Blackball Media, of which I am also MD, edits Nissan Insider. But I am not the editor. There's no axe to grind here. I like to support British manufacturers - but when they lose their way and make outlandish claims, as Vauxhall have done here, it makes sense to question them. No one from the manufacturer has contacted me, but then I suspect you are, in some way, connected... 

[Jon Reay 4]

I know you edit the Nissan Insider website and I can't help but feel that if Nissan's UK MD had said something like this, you'd probably have called it 'brave' or 'ambitious' - and Vauxhall outsells Nissan in the UK two-to-one. Tell me I'm wrong...

 

Thing is though, Nissan have taken such a jump in sales (and let's be honest, product desirability) over the last few years that further growth seems entirely plausible. Look at where the Qashqai and Juke are compared to where the Primera and Almera were ten years ago – there's been quite a change. 

 

Vauxhall, on the other hand, are almost exactly where they were in 2003. While Nissan are ploughing on into (and sometimes creating) new segments, Vauxhall have had basically the same model range since 1983. Aside from the Adam, which is a reasonably clever idea but badly executed and far too late to the party, the Corsa, Astra and Insignia have nothing new or remarkable going for them. 

 

Current volume is all well and good, but before you start talking about stealing sales from other manufacturers, there has to actually be a reason for buyers to flock to the brand – and I just don't see there being one. 

[Andy Entwistle 96]

I don't believe there can be too much biased opinion here. See our story on the most influential manufacturers on Twitter, vauxhall come in an impressive 3rd !

 

With a stronger line up of product, they could really put this to good use !

[christhomson 2]

It's true the sister company to Blackball Media, of which I am also MD, edits Nissan Insider. But I am not the editor.

Erm, are you sure? http://postimg.org/image/5a2okikp7/

[James Baggott 227]

Oh dear, that is rather old. Thanks for reminding me. It even had Batch down as an editor and he's been in charge of Car Dealer since January! Doh! 

 

http://nissaninsider.co.uk/contact-us/

 

Ps - I take it that means you agree with all my other points, though? That's good to know...

[Jon Reay 4]

Oh dear, that is rather old. Thanks for reminding me. It even had Batch down as an editor and he's been in charge of Car Dealer since January! Doh! 

 

http://nissaninsider.co.uk/contact-us/

 

Ps - I take it that means you agree with all my other points, though? That's good to know...

 

Batch does have a habit of doing that. Swear to God he handed me a shopping list the other day and he'd scribbled 'Editor - James Batchelor' on the back. 

[christhomson 2]

Ah. You can see how I was confused. I am so sorry for implying bias where there is clearly none. I dunno, I think motor industry executives say a lot that should be taken with a pinch of salt.

[Stuart 2]

I don't think James is alone in his opinion (which is exactly what a column is, an individual's opinion) that Vauxhall are on a hiding to nothing by claiming they will be number one within three years. For start, have they explained how they will sell an additional 50k units between now and then? Aside from the lacklustre product line, the uninspiring dealerships - grey boxes with gaudy vinyls on the window's telling me how cheap the product is, how very 1989, and a salesmen sat at a remote desks wearing a branded anorak aimlessly clicking a mouse trying to get their PC to work, what else does Vauxhall bring to the market place?

 

Don't get me wrong, most Ford dealerships are just as inviting, by which I mean you wouldn't want to step inside one without wearing protective clothing, but where the Blue Oval falls down on sales presentation it makes up for with innovative, or at least competitive product. Cars people actually want to buy. Once in a while they'll build a halo model, too. What both Ford and Vauxhall seem oblivious too, arrogant even, is the threat from Korea in the shape of Kia and Hyundai. Not only are they investing in product that people want to buy, but they also offer a buying environment that meets people's expectations. They may be buying a cheap car, but the buying experience is far from value. 

 

And let's not forget, many people will never forgive Vauxhall for bringing Griff Rhys Jones into their living room wearing nothing but a pair of Y-Fronts. 

[Andy Entwistle 96]

 

And let's not forget, many people will never forgive Vauxhall for bringing Griff Rhys Jones into their living room wearing nothing but a pair of Y-Fronts. 

 

 

:-)

[christhomson 2]

LOL isn't saying Vauxhall has thrown toys out of pram and then linking back to your blog just showing that you have thrown toys out of your pram too? You must see the irony!

[James Baggott 227]

I like irony :)

[christhomson 2]

You must do! If you think their cars are so bad, why do you even want to drive em? You're not whatcar so can't you just pick and choose which cars you test?

[James Baggott 227]

Vauxhall are the second biggest selling manufacturer in the UK. Their dealers and our readers expect to hear about their new products.

[Ian 15]

There is no way on this planet that Vauxhall's current range is on a par with that of Ford. This is the strongest ever Ford line up, there's work for all manufacturers to catch up.

[christhomson 2]

Wait, Vauxhall is the second best-selling brand in the UK?! Can't all be fleet sales, so how can that be James? You said you can't see anyone spending their own money on one! I guess tens of thousands of people think you're wrong...

I guess I wondered why you need to physically test drive the vehicles when your readers typically aren't reading your mag for car buying/choosing advice - or are they?

Did you actually ask the press office about the quote once you'd found it on the Mail Online by the way? I'm not suggesting the "no.1" thing is realistic, just wondering what journalistic lengths you went to to try to clarify the statement or press for more details on how they'd accomplish it?

One rival magazine seemed to do exactly that...

[James Baggott 227]

Well the thing is 'Chris', as I'm sure you know because I somehow guess you're very closely related to the press office (a little more than a hunch and your tenacity on this subject gives that away), for a press office to operate effectively it needs to return calls and emails.

When we asked the 'PR' director down for lunch at our offices - three times via email - each and every one of them was flatly ignored.

When we asked for a comment about how great they thought their own Insignia was for a feature - we wanted 75 words - we were told they were too busy and couldn't get it to us in two weeks. Yes, two weeks. Perhaps they didn't think it was great after all and couldn't bring themself to lie...

Maybe this press office needs a little help and maybe an agency to help them too? But, judging by the way this has been mis-managed, we think they're beyond that.

You see if their PR director doesn't return calls or emails it makes the process of asking for comment pretty tricky. We tried to contact them. In fact we've tried many times, but it appears the art of operating a telephone, or that futuristic communication tool, email, has baffled them.

You're also forgetting 'Chris', or perhaps didn't realise, that the Blackball Media journalists don't just run Car Dealer, they write for other outlets too where car tests are required.

Surely the best way to solve this would have been to pick up the phone, god forbid, talked to us and sorted out an interview with Duncan.

But we suspect his ludicrous statement was just that and the fact he hasn't been offered up for interview, and this whole sorry state of affairs has occurred instead, is because Vauxhall know they could never back up such bravado.

Perhaps they'll man up, or someone may give them some sensible PR advice, and they'll do just that. But with the dinosaurs they've got running the offices there I for one very much doubt it...

[Jon Reay 4]

*Loud noises*

 

...we do have other topics here too, y'know

[jimreidvehicle 255]

Everyone I think you'll find the original question was "Do you think Vauxhall could ever take the number one spot from Ford?"

 

The article written is strong and yes it would undoubtably manage to rub Vauxhall up the wrong way to get at least a reaction from them, even if that reaction was negative, which it did! But it comes back to the same thing James has asked, apart from a cheap advertising stunt from the Chairman /MD of Vauxhall stating that they would take top spot by 2016 without backing up the claim with why or how he thinks they will achieve this. Apart from being 2nd for so many years, the facts are that Vauxhall have never been close to top spot, even when Ford were stringing out the old Escort (before Focus times)! So with all this in mind back to the original question "Do you think Vauxhall could ever take the number one spot from Ford?" 

 

With the current line up.........I doubt it!

[christhomson 2]

I have no absolutely PR experience, so I have no clue whether PR folk would see what they have done as a good or bad thing. Anyway, I doubt either party is being totally honest about what has happened. There has been a total breakdown in the relationship and it can't possibly just be down to the things made public.

You're arguing that they have overreacted to what you wrote, but have you considered that you went overboard in your loathing of their product? You're entitled to an opinion and maybe it really is that their cars are utterly dire and no-one would buy one (even though thousands do) but how can you be surprised at their reaction? If I wrote that "all Porsches are sh*t", I would hardly be surprised if Porsche didn't return my calls. The only person in the industry who gets away with that sort of blanket ridiculing of cars is Clarkson and he's a) smart enough to know he's going to piss people off and doesn't care. When I write, I am able to express my opinions about cars without pissing off manufacturers. I care about the relationships I have with them. I think your problem is that you are quite happy to piss people off, but can't understand why that's a problem.

I don't think anyone has questioned the valid point you made in asking how they could possibly overtake Ford. I've only seen criticism of the way you did it. Your column was essentially a diatribe against the current model line-up designed to goad or provoke Vauxhall into a reaction. So it's rather strange that you seem so shocked and angry that you've achieved your objective.

What you wrote didn't sound like the professional and informed comment of an established magazine editor, but the rant of a bitter keyboard warrior. It's hilarious that you imply Vauxhall is chucking its toys out of its proverbial pram when you then post private emails all over the your blog. I mean, seriously, who does that?! Not any professional journalist I know, that's for sure. Do you think you're Edward Snowden or something? The words 'delusions of grandeur' come to mind...

[Jon Reay 4]

What you wrote didn't sound like the professional and informed comment of an established magazine editor, but the rant of a bitter keyboard warrior. 

 

...and this, your seventh ranty reply in here (with no other posts anywhere else, funnily enough...) would say much the same about you, so I'd suggest that now is a good time to call it quits.

 

You've had your say – you disagree, we get it. Now, let's leave it at that. 

 

Happy families now? Okie doke then.

[christhomson 2]

Oh right, so the MD of a media company posts a blog titled "Now Vauxhall PR boss Denis Chick’s email is banned. So here it is again." and you think I'm the one who has a problem letting things go? I guess I'm the kettle and you're the pot...

(I see Baggott has deleted his tweet about the above - a bit of back-pedalling perhaps? And by the way Mr Reay, the difference is that I'm not purporting to be an established magazine editor).

Get over yourselves guys. Either you carry on behaving like a bunch of amateurs and you deal with the inevitable consequences (and stop complaining) or you act professionally and get treated like adults. Believe me, every other serious magazine is looking at you and laughing.

[Jon Reay 4]

And you think I'm the one who has a problem letting things go? 

 

In a word, yep

 

Seriously though, I'm bored now. Take the mud-slinging somewhere else, please.

[James Baggott 227]

Agreed Jon. This isn't a forum for anonymous postings from non motor traders. If you're that upset with the column perhaps man up a bit and pick up the phone and talk to me. Happy to chat any time 'Chris'. Have a great Christmas.