SK Motors

Thanks for the reply. I told him I used to provide Warrantywise warranties but as I didn't sell enough cars they closed my account. I told him I didn't offer a specific warranty as such and he was fine with that. I'm thinking it's best that I offer for him to return the car to me for a refund as I can see further trouble from him in the future even if I paid for the repair. Can I tell him he's liable for the cost of returning it to me and how do I negotiate a lower value for the car bearing in mind he's had it 7 weeks, done some 1500 miles in it and it has a fault that's going to cost at least £560 to repair?

I hope I don't get shot down for posting this on here but I genuinely need some advice regarding a car I've sold that's developed a fault. It was a Bmw M3 SMG that I took in px. I put it into my local Bmw specialist for inspection service and a general check over which identified a few problems that I had rectified costing some £600. I sold it 7 weeks ago with 12 months mot. The buyer test drove it and was 100% happy with it and signed an invoice stating that no faults were present at the point of sale. I took a classic Mercedes from him in part exchange. He contacted me a few days ago saying that the SMG gearbox had developed a fault where it was sticking in gear and also selecting the wrong gear. He said this should throw a fault light on the dash which it wasn't so he removed the cluster to find the warning light had been covered over with black tape ! Something I wasn't aware of neither the BMW specialist. He accused me of doing this and said he wanted to return the car for a refund as the fault was present at the point of sale. I obviously denied doing this and refused to accept the car back for a refund as he'd had it for longer than 30 days and also I don't agree that any fault was present at the point of sale which is backed up by the invoice he signed. I've been talking to him by email/text over the last few days and I've gone out of my way to help diagnose the fault as he wasn't prepared to take it anywhere as he wasn't happy driving it. It's been diagnosed as a faulty gear position sensor which is £560 fitted in my local Bmw specialist. I was just in the process of emailing him some options when I get a long email from him stating he's contacted trading standards and as the fault must've been present at the point of sale ( he says trading standards say it's not on him to prove it was there but on me to prove it wasn't ) that he's giving me 7 days from today to collect the car (he's 3.5 hours away from me) and return it to him fully repaired otherwise he will start court proceedings against me. Where do I stand with this ? I was going to offer to pay 50% of the cost before he sent that email. Can I offer to buy the car back at a reduced amount for him owning it 7 weeks ? Another owner on V5 etc ? He's quoted in the email that any car sold by a trader displaying a fault within 6 months from sale must've been faulty at the point of sale ! This is the first problem I've had in 5 years of trading from home so I'm not particularly familiar with the process. I was happy to help him with the cost and everything seemed amicable until I received this threatening email. Sorry for the long post but I'd appreciate your advice.

My thoughts exactly. If somebody wanted to move a dodgy car around, they've made it a lot easier. In theory, you could completely remove the original plates and stick the trade plates on.

I've bought a set of the plate holders for £15 which has 2 suction cups and a bungee cord for each plate. Ironically, I used them for the first time yesterday and past one of those DVLA camera vans with the 4 cameras on the roof ! The car I was driving wasn't taxed so I'm guessing had I not covered the VRM I would've potentially got fined for no tax and not displaying the trade plates correctly.

My trade plates are added onto my trade policy. My insurance company were saying the original VRM shouldn't be covered as it could be a stolen car for example and the Police wouldn't be able to see the VRM. I just wanted to check on here before buying trade plate holders etc so thanks for replying. What are regarded as the best plate holders as I really don't like the idea of the plates flying off somewhere ?

Can anyone clarify how Trade plates should be displayed by law ? I've been putting them in the front windscreen and rear window for the last few years with no issues but I've just heard from someone who got stopped by the Police as the original VRM was on display. The Police say the Trade plates should cover the original VRM. However, my insurance company says the original VRM should NOT be covered and putting the Trade plates in the front and rear windows is perfectly fine !

Just spoke to them this evening and they require a minimum 1 sale per week ! They suggested I try Warranty Direct, anyone got any views on what they're like ?

Thanks for that, I'll look into them.

As a part time trader from home I've been using Warrantywise to provide my warranties. When I joined up with them there was no problem with me being part time, no minimum number of sales per month etc. Just recently my account manager has left and a new one taken over, they told me I needed to sell 2-4 warranties per month otherwise they would close my account ! Had an email from account manager yesterday saying they've failed to contact me on numerous occasions and the underwriters had reviewed my account and have decided to close my trade account with immediate effect. I've spoken to them this morning and explained I've had no missed calls or messages from anyone and that I have 2 vehicles for sale both advertising they will come Warrantywise warranties. They aren't interested and have just said I will have to use their website for warranties which for the one vehicle is £690 for 12 months cover instead of £280 ! Can anyone recommend a warranty company that will allow a part time trader selling 1 or 2 vehicles a month to provide their warranties or am I really better off just self warranting ?

You may have needed planning permission from your local council but I can assure you that I consulted my local council before starting trading and I have it in writing from them that I do not require planning permission to trade in the way that I am. If I turned my driveway into a forecourt then obviously that would be a different situation ! I shouldn't have to explain my circumstances on here,but how do you know what my situation is personally ? I have an understanding employer who allows me to be self employed alongside being employed by him,he allows me to have cars delivered to his premises,he allows me to take time off during the day to go and collect cars,time out for someone to come and view a car etc. He's fully aware that I'm considering leaving and doing this full time, I've even discussed renting premises from him ! I have no need to enjoy it while I'm "getting away with it", I run my accounts accurately, I pay my tax and NI (through my employment and self employment I might add) and I will become Vat registered if I think I will hit the threshold or definitely if I start doing it full time. The people who you lot should really be getting frustrated with are the ones selling 10 cars a month through Facebook for example who are claiming to be unemployed while making thousands per year and there's literally 100's of them doing that !

You seem to keep twisting what I'm saying! Where did I say that I feel all the trade are unscrupulous when you get to a certain size? The point you're missing is that you're assuming I'm planning on trading like I am now forever just to avoid paying for premises etc which is certainly not the case. All I've tried doing up to now is build my business up to the point where I think it would be worth getting premises etc. I don't want to keep arguing with you on here, you've made your point that you don't like 'home traders' and that's fine. You've made your point that people like me shouldn't come on this forum asking for help as I did and I certainly won't bother doing it again.

If that's what I wanted to say then I would've said that wouldn't I! I already know where 'bigger' dealers source their cars from. What makes me laugh is the implication that I'm a chancer because I work hard enough to keep a full time job and run my own business and also help my partner run her business and have chosen to run under the Vat threshold. What you're implying is I'd be less of a chancer if I run from a small lot with a handful of old cars as long as I was Vat registered? I give up with this forum now, I'd rather argue my point face to face with all of you rather than from behind a keyboard! I came on here thinking we were in the same boat whether we are 'home traders' or established dealers, obviously I didn't realise the few of you together had such a problem with people like me. Can I just remind you that even if people like me could no longer source stock from trade sources, we could still source stock from private sellers at the right price. I've done a few myself in this way and made more profit per car than some from trade sources! Also, I could make far, far more profit by going back to sourcing cars that need clutch/flywheel replacements and repairing them myself. I'm a bloody good mechanic aswell but I didn't want to continue spending all my time working on repairing cars and chose to concentrate more on sales. Can you define what a 'proper' trader is as I know for a fact there's some very unscrupulous dealers out there that have nice shiny showrooms with all the packages etc?

Well I've obviously upset you enough for you to start a thread which is obviously directed at me! I never said at any point that I had no intention of going full time and being fully committed to the trade. Why do you think I've been trading up, learning along the way, doing research into how to become more professional, becoming vat registered, warranties, consumer law etc. Also, you keep making reference to me trading £10,000 cars but avoiding being Vat registered. I said I have traded anything up to £10,000, That was one car at that value! When I first started trading I worked around 50 hours a week in my employment before doing anything with cars. I had a source where I bought cars that needed clutches or dual mass flywheels replacing, I worked every night and every weekend repairing these myself and then sold them on. That made me enough money to buy better cars and so on. I've been into cars all my life, I've built cars up from scratch, I've been involved with tuning Cosworths back in the day and with Japanese performance cars. Just because my full time employment is not related to the trade doesn't mean I'm just playing around and I've not put my full circumstances or reasons on here because it's nothing to do with anyone else. At the end of the day, I've made sure I'm as legal as I need to be, I work bloody hard to get where I am and I only posted on here hoping for some friendly help and didn't expect to get shot down like I have been. I'll carry on regardless, maybe I'll make it, maybe I won't!

This site obviously isn't going to be as helpful as I thought it would be! For your information I spoke to our local council regarding planning permission before I started trading and was told that as long as I don't advertise cars from the property or have lots of people coming and going everyday then I wouldn't need permission. I also declare everything I earn! I could easily tar all dealers with the same brush as people are trying to do to me on here!

Thank you! I don't see myself as a chancer at all. I sell cars usually with long mot, good service history, excellent warranty cover and a friendly, no pressure environment.

As much as I agree that some cars go way over what we would pay to make a profit, why does not being Vat registered mean people are 'chancers'? You still have to prove you're in the trade by means of trade insurance, trade plates, proof of trading etc. Tried emailing you but it came back as 'undeliverable' for some reason!

Auction4cars didn't require Vat registration when I signed up to them some time ago iirc.

I didn't mean to avoid becoming Vat registered in any other way than to just make sure I don't turn over more than the threshold. My concern with going Vat registered is the extra time it'll take to run the accounts etc bearing in mind it's just me on my own and I have a full time job and also my partner runs a business from home which includes evenings and weekends! I'm not some dodgy trader trying to avoid paying tax or Vat, I'm just trying to get along in life the best way I can!

Well, I believe the threshold is £81,000 ? In the early days I was selling much cheaper cars so it was easier but as I'm getting into more expensive cars I can obviously only sell a certain amount until I hit the threshold. How difficult is it being Vat registered, bearing in mind I'm running on a part time basis? Everyone's been telling me for ages to avoid being Vat registered at all costs!

Hi, I've been what you would call a part time home trader for around 3 1/2 years now alongside my main employment in an engineering/manufacturing business. I started off selling cars around £1000 a time but now sell anything up to around £10,000. Over the time I've been trading I've sourced stock from Dealerbid, Autotrade-mail, auction4cars.com, Dealerpx.com and I've just signed up to Autorola. I left Autotrade-mail due to the high cost and not getting a great number of cars through there (Most seemed either already sold or I couldn't get a response from the seller). It seemed the right decision as their attitude when I cancelled was basically to make it as hard as possible and charge me as much as possible !! Recently (around 18 months) I've sold mainly main dealer px's and provide warranties from Warrantywise which seemed to be going very well until now. I've really struggled sourcing stock at the right price to enable any profit at all ! I've tried joining other online sources such as Dealer-auction but as I'm not Vat registered they aren't interested with the exception of Autorola who once I'd provided proof of trading etc allowed me to join. I'm not overly impressed with the way the system works, what's other peoples opinions of them ? Are there any other online stock sources I haven't mentioned that I could join without being Vat registered ?