Bye bye autotrader

[JimmyGlen 13]

28 minutes ago, justina3 said:

I was reading on the IMBD facebook page autotrader now list your car higher on the listings due to recommendations ! is that customer reviews ?

Hi @justina3, it was me who posted it. It can't be review driven, as there was a private first in the search when filtering by 'Recommended'.

I'd love to know what algorithm AT use to power this search filter. 

Stevie 

[Rory RSC 596]

57 minutes ago, justina3 said:

I was reading on the IMBD facebook page autotrader now list your car higher on the listings due to recommendations ! is that customer reviews ?

Just a test I reckon as can't replicate it, can any of you?  

 

[Area 51 33]

2 hours ago, JimmyGlen said:

Hi @justina3, it was me who posted it. It can't be review driven, as there was a private first in the search when filtering by 'Recommended'.

I'd love to know what algorithm AT use to power this search filter. 

Stevie 

I would love to know more on this AI algorithm crap full stop! Its in all walks of bloody business.. Utter crap in most instances.. I like to understand the tools I am using and use the right one for the job! Rather than spending time clutching at straws/stabbing (forgive the term pls) in the dark..

I read recently on US techy website, the problem with AI and algorithms is that they are all "written" by someone. You need to understand clearly what motivates the person writing it..

Their own opinions, life style and agenda will influence the algorithm produced, basically any two brains are not the same.... We all know from the press that fairness and honesty are usually the lowest on the list of the factors when web companies are found wanting.. Profit and manipulation/market dominance are usually list first in those same factors..

I think AT has got too smart for its own good right now and the algorithm is fcuked up hence more saying we get less inquiries.... If the car is right and priced right, billies will find it because its what they want..

So why cant AT deliver the billies and the other sales channels do?? Someone is doing something different, and it appears to be broken at AT right now...the recent results of moving off there are very positive reading...   All a bit deep, but I do hate the grip these ffffing web companies now have on businesses.. controlling where you're advert appear/fake reviews etc

I have no pity for the tosser in AT looking at reducing revenue from dealer packages

[trade vet 697]

I have to say that if we had a big pitch,big overheads,lots of heavy metal with big mark ups etc,I would be staying with AT and also using the others.We used to spend 2 grand a week with AT and others years ago but our wage bill was nearly 5 grand and it all worked.Now as a ‘non league player’ things are different.By rights we should have very cheap rates with AT ( as an ethical company according to them) because we must have spent several million with them since the early 80’s but it has changed hands about 3 times since,so no chance of that.

[Funny Farm 7]

Since the start of the year we have only sold 18 through Autotrader at a cost of roughly £11000 subscription to date, this means Autotrader has made more profits from my sales than I have (£611 per car). I have sold 15 via Ebay at £988 (£59 per car) - 3 from Car Gurus (£0 per car) - 2 Gumtree (£15 per add) 1 car Network (£0).

We all know times are slow for what ever reasons however this time last year Autotrader was costing £243 per car sale (acceptable), now this figure is at £611. 

Can anyone else provide a sales v cost analysis. It would be interesting to see the other dealers figures. Simply take the total Autotrader cost since start of the year divide that by amount of autotrader sales.

[Nick M.K. 574]

8 minutes ago, Funny Farm said:

Simply take the total Autotrader cost since start of the year divide that by amount of autotrader sales.

Easier said than done. 

Depending on the systems you have in place it is difficult to attribute a sale to an advertising platform from leads other than direct phone calls. 

I did a deal on Saturday after the customers messaged me on our company facebook page. I don't advertise on Facebook, I use the page very infrequently, yet I received their message and thought that maybe they found the car through a Google search and "facebooked" us. 

Just before they drove off I remebered to ask them where they saw the car advertised and of course it was Autotrader. "We didn't look anywhere else"

If I had advertised on Facebook or never asked that question I would've wrongly attributed that sale to another platform. 

[Rory RSC 596]

1 hour ago, Nick M.K. said:

Easier said than done. 

Depending on the systems you have in place it is difficult to attribute a sale to an advertising platform from leads other than direct phone calls. 

I did a deal on Saturday after the customers messaged me on our company facebook page. I don't advertise on Facebook, I use the page very infrequently, yet I received their message and thought that maybe they found the car through a Google search and "facebooked" us. 

Just before they drove off I remebered to ask them where they saw the car advertised and of course it was Autotrader. "We didn't look anywhere else"

If I had advertised on Facebook or never asked that question I would've wrongly attributed that sale to another platform. 

We always ask the question where did you see it and allow them to answer.

If their call or email came in before hand we have a bit more evidence. We also ask most did they only use that site or did they see us anywhere else?

 

Being totally objective and looking at your own business are your adverts well written, cars priced to market, do you use video, do you have some feedback and reviews, are you playing the autotrader game so to speak. If its 

£611 per sale. I wouldn't be on here posting about that I would be thinking its not working for me, and handing in notice. Its ridiculous.

[umesh 336]

19 minutes ago, Rory RSC said:

We always ask the question where did you see it and allow them to answer.

If their call or email came in before hand we have a bit more evidence. We also ask most did they only use that site or did they see us anywhere else?

 

Being totally objective and looking at your own business are your adverts well written, cars priced to market, do you use video, do you have some feedback and reviews, are you playing the autotrader game so to speak. If its 

£611 per sale. I wouldn't be on here posting about that I would be thinking its not working for me, and handing in notice. Its ridiculous.

Obviously the ‘call whisper’ is a major advantage as it tells us all instantly where the lead is from, I always ask too and it gets asked again on a feedback form that I give to all my customers.

The magic bit that none of know is did the customer search Google then on to a classified platforms or a direct search on the platforms.

Cost per sale from AT is getting a lot higher from many, many conversations I’m having with dealers, seems lots getting lot less leads/sales.

Average per sale I’m begin told is between £150-£200 (some of the bigger players it may be lower) thanks  @funnyfarm for numbers to share with us, that’s a massive chunk per unit and there has to be a way to bring that down.

 As @nick I had a sale a few weeks ago via FB Messenger but it was instigated by an advert on AT! Just shows how customers keep moving around, the reason was they were ‘checking ‘my social media profile’ and were happy that I as real  !

[Ash_83 0]

Hi guys. Newbie here. Well i always read the forums, but today I have joined. Glad to see that all traders are sick to death of being robbed by AT.

[justina3 518]

19 minutes ago, Ash_83 said:

Hi guys. Newbie here. Well i always read the forums, but today I have joined. Glad to see that all traders are sick to death of being robbed by AT.

I dont think its all traders some people clearly do well from it others dont. 

You pays your money and all that 

[andymc1973 199]

its not a robbery its a choice

[david gott 58]

This debate will go on forever, the only way to know if you can live without trader is to give it a year not using it and do the maths.

[Nick M.K. 574]

31 minutes ago, andymc1973 said:

its not a robbery its a choice

I don't understand everyone that talks about AT robbery all the time. We are not talking some garages here, or repairs, or expensive parts or £12000 for a diagnostic machine or customers that lie about their p/x, it's just an advertiser. A service provider that can be switched off with a single phone call. No sneaky 24 month contracts like other companies (i.e. iVendi), no fees for late payment or £15 a day storage charges. As above it's a pure choice. And it DOES WORK. 

Imagine a marketplace full of many cheap advertisers that DON'T work. 

[trade vet 697]

1 hour ago, Nick M.K. said:

I don't understand everyone that talks about AT robbery all the time. We are not talking some garages here, or repairs, or expensive parts or £12000 for a diagnostic machine or customers that lie about their p/x, it's just an advertiser. A service provider that can be switched off with a single phone call. No sneaky 24 month contracts like other companies (i.e. iVendi), no fees for late payment or £15 a day storage charges. As above it's a pure choice. And it DOES WORK. 

Imagine a marketplace full of many cheap advertisers that DON'T work. 

Just got our EBay/Gumtree contract through thanks to you Nick.The guy was insisting it was £399 p/m but when we told him that our other branch had just done a deal £227 he relented.

[Nick M.K. 574]

1 minute ago, trade vet said:

Just got our EBay/Gumtree contract through thanks to you Nick.The guy was insisting it was £399 p/m but when we told him that our other branch had just done a deal £227 he relented.

Great news! It's a bit annoying when they have their pricing all over the place. 

[Mark101 536]

1 minute ago, Nick M.K. said:

Great news! It's a bit annoying when they have their pricing all over the place. 

I'm arguing with them too.

I've told them (without saying anyone's name or business), that I will not be renewing when a similar sized business to me can get the same deal at half the price.

Waiting for a call back tomorow.

[Nick M.K. 574]

Just now, Mark101 said:

I've told them (without saying anyone's name or business), that I will not be renewing when a similar sized business to me can get the same deal at half the price.

Waiting for a call back tomorow.

Push them a bit Mark, should work. Fingers crossed. 

[Mark101 536]

I know many moan about AT, me included but at least (as far as I can tell), everyone gets the same rate depending on which package they go on.

If they don't play, I will go back to AT.

Thanks for the heads up Nick - see you in a couple of months 

[Nick M.K. 574]

1 minute ago, Mark101 said:

Thanks for the heads up Nick - see you in a couple of months

Would've been in a couple of weeks after I got fed up waiting over 10 days for BCA Wolverhampton to deliver two cars to me but my other half is taking me away on hols tomorrow so BCA have all the time in the world now :-)

[justina3 518]

4 minutes ago, Nick M.K. said:

Would've been in a couple of weeks after I got fed up waiting over 10 days for BCA Wolverhampton to deliver two cars to me but my other half is taking me away on hols tomorrow so BCA have all the time in the world now :-)

Who are you using for delivery to make you wait like that ? movex or shiply quote a collected and delivery date which is never wrong, well to me anyway 

[Nick M.K. 574]

Just now, justina3 said:

movex or shiply quote a collected and delivery date which is never wrong, well to me anyway 

Tried both, average quote around £150 per vehicle. BCA came at £95, quoted 3-5 working days, seemed OK at the time. I almost never have cars delivered and will probably stick to my local Blackbushe from now on. 

[Mark101 536]

9 minutes ago, Nick M.K. said:

Tried both, average quote around £150 per vehicle. BCA came at £95, quoted 3-5 working days, seemed OK at the time. I almost never have cars delivered and will probably stick to my local Blackbushe from now on. 

BCA Wolves made me wait almost 10 days but Manheim Birmingham, I get the cars usually within 48 (business) hours and at £65 a car, it is not much dearer than time/taxi/fuel to collect. 

[Nick M.K. 574]

11 minutes ago, Mark101 said:

I get the cars usually within 48 (business) hours and at £65 a car, it is not much dearer than time/taxi/fuel to collect. 

I'd usually buy 3-5 at a time from BB, pay and collect all keys / docs etc. Then on different days my wife would drop me off at one of the endless car parks which are long distance away from the main site but easy to get to by car and it takes us forty minutes from our place and maybe a tenner in diesel. I have attached a photo of one of their lovely world class facilities: 

And another from the times when cars were parked on site which is right next to the airport: 

 

Edited April 8, 2019 by Nick M.K.

[Mark101 536]

lol 

[NickGCS 14]

10 hours ago, Funny Farm said:

Since the start of the year we have only sold 18 through Autotrader at a cost of roughly £11000 subscription to date, this means Autotrader has made more profits from my sales than I have (£611 per car). I have sold 15 via Ebay at £988 (£59 per car) - 3 from Car Gurus (£0 per car) - 2 Gumtree (£15 per add) 1 car Network (£0).

We all know times are slow for what ever reasons however this time last year Autotrader was costing £243 per car sale (acceptable), now this figure is at £611. 

Can anyone else provide a sales v cost analysis. It would be interesting to see the other dealers figures. Simply take the total Autotrader cost since start of the year divide that by amount of autotrader sales.

We only have data from the last 2 months but from that it was £360 per unit.

I was in the same mindset as you, as I thought it was far too dear. however I then looked at the “extra” sales we accumulated from AT, and the profit that brought it, not just net profit but finance comm, good swappers and any profit we gained from them, and while it seemed expensive on a per car basis ( and it is in comparison to other platforms) without it we wouldn’t have made the extra profit from those extra AT sales!

I hate to admit it but it more than paid for itself, ROI I believe is the important thing