Jimbo 11 Posted January 13, 2018 Finding it harder and harder to buy decent stock at cap average prices to leave enough to build in a worthwile profit. Seemingly now its more cap clean and over for most stock. Were in the south east. Is this normal across the board?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dealer 54 Posted January 13, 2018 Alas there was a time when average or below was the norm......... Can even remember getting stock at below the below! Tis getting harder and harder to find them at these prices, add the fees, prep costs, delivery etc and there isn't a great deal left. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mistermuttley 19 Posted January 14, 2018 I know its hard and i do do it myself but traders need to set a limit and then stop. Sometimes i've gone to my max bid with a car with just a small profit in it and then the car has gone up another £200-£300 quid. I just cant see how these dealers are making anything. Generally now at Manheim B'ham I bid on about 6 or 7 and either get 1 or none. If everyone was strict with their max bids then the prices would drop but when there is something there you really like it easy to go over a bit.Might start trying to get some from facebook/gumtree. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trade vet 704 Posted January 14, 2018 If our guys relied on cap valuations,we would not have a business.Most of our stuff is well over Cap clean.I get tired of traders complaining about missing stuff because it was over Cap clean,when what they were after might have £2000 worth of extra spec. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rory RSC 596 Posted January 14, 2018 26 minutes ago, trade vet said: If our guys relied on cap valuations,we would not have a business.Most of our stuff is well over Cap clean.I get tired of traders complaining about missing stuff because it was over Cap clean,when what they were after might have £2000 worth of extra spec. Very much how I operate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
metcars 397 Posted January 14, 2018 As far as auctions are concerned CAP clean seems to now be the reserve they aim for. CAP average and below average don't exist any more? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
andymc1973 199 Posted January 14, 2018 And yet we put our cars through and we achieve cap shite 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trade vet 704 Posted January 14, 2018 48 minutes ago, andymc1973 said: And yet we put our cars through and we achieve cap shite Ha Ha....Andy,it’s been like that forever,unless of course you bung the yard manager for a good position followed by a bigger bung for the auctioneer for a good build up.Then of course if you ‘ring the bell’ there is an extra success fee for the auctioneer.Am I right or am I right,that was the way it used to be,has it changed ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 11 Posted January 14, 2018 Only issue seems buying in costs more than cap clean and often selling price gets less than cap retail ..... squeeeeeeze Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 164 Posted January 14, 2018 5 hours ago, trade vet said: If our guys relied on cap valuations,we would not have a business.Most of our stuff is well over Cap clean.I get tired of traders complaining about missing stuff because it was over Cap clean,when what they were after might have £2000 worth of extra spec. +1 I know a chap who moans about going over cap clean but a lot of cars make way over cap retail. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arfur Dealy 823 Posted January 14, 2018 7 hours ago, trade vet said: If our guys relied on cap valuations,we would not have a business.Most of our stuff is well over Cap clean.I get tired of traders complaining about missing stuff because it was over Cap clean,when what they were after might have £2000 worth of extra spec. Exactly, the black book used to be clean + £500 for extras like leather & Satnav. You don't see that in the valuations, each car I bid on I do a quick search within 100 miles to see the competition then retail back to my max bid, I stick to it religiously.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 11 Posted January 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Arfur Dealy said: Exactly, the black book used to be clean + £500 for extras like leather & Satnav. You don't see that in the valuations, each car I bid on I do a quick search within 100 miles to see the competition then retail back to my max bid, I stick to it religiously.... Prob is when we do that we’re effectively seeing an “advertised” price on AT. Not so much a “sold” price. A car on AT @ £8k doesnt always mean its worth £8k as a sale ive found 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arfur Dealy 823 Posted January 14, 2018 1 minute ago, Jimbo said: Prob is when we do that we’re effectively seeing an “advertised” price on AT. Not so much a “sold” price. A car on AT @ £8k doesnt always mean its worth £8k as a sale ive found Agreed, but I don’t negotiate my price, the price is the price. A lot of buyers don’t want to negotiate, they want ease and simplicity. Also, our market is competitive, I don’t know a lot of local dealers who reduce. How many times do you sell a car over the phone when they buyer doesn’t even try to negotiate ?? For me it’s every time Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dealer 54 Posted January 14, 2018 6 minutes ago, Arfur Dealy said: Agreed, but I don’t negotiate my price, the price is the price. A lot of buyers don’t want to negotiate, they want ease and simplicity. Also, our market is competitive, I don’t know a lot of local dealers who reduce. How many times do you sell a car over the phone when they buyer doesn’t even try to negotiate ?? For me it’s every time Sorry but this isn't the way for me, 2 customers today, both wanted substantial amounts off and 1 even wanted 2 tyres and a major service. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trade vet 704 Posted January 14, 2018 10 minutes ago, Jimbo said: Prob is when we do that we’re effectively seeing an “advertised” price on AT. Not so much a “sold” price. A car on AT @ £8k doesnt always mean its worth £8k as a sale ive found I would say that a good per centage of £8k stuff will have a swapper,so any negotiation will be with the swapper and not the selling price.Cap GUIDE is a long way out on a lot of stuff and when mid Feb comes it will be outeven more.It has always been the same whether it is Cap,Glasses or the other one ( if it is still around )which they used to flog at the old Chelmsford ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
metcars 397 Posted January 14, 2018 53 minutes ago, trade vet said: I would say that a good per centage of £8k stuff will have a swapper,so any negotiation will be with the swapper and not the selling price.Cap GUIDE is a long way out on a lot of stuff and when mid Feb comes it will be outeven more.It has always been the same whether it is Cap,Glasses or the other one ( if it is still around )which they used to flog at the old Chelmsford ! Yes, I remember that. Didn't they used to advertise in Car Auction Magazine (remember that!) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arfur Dealy 823 Posted January 14, 2018 1 hour ago, Dealer said: Sorry but this isn't the way for me, 2 customers today, both wanted substantial amounts off and 1 even wanted 2 tyres and a major service. ???? Did you is my point, I don't negotiate. All of my cars are sold prior to viewing and collection. Buy it Now Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lakeside 94 Posted January 14, 2018 (edited) Depends on the time of year, now no but in a few months time when we start hitting holiday season I think we will. i still managed a few below cap below around April/June time last year. Edited January 14, 2018 by Lakeside Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rory RSC 596 Posted January 15, 2018 12 hours ago, Arfur Dealy said: ???? Did you is my point, I don't negotiate. All of my cars are sold prior to viewing and collection. Buy it Now No discounts here unless I am sick of the sight of it and trying to get rid. You may also get a small amount out of me if I am in a good mood and sold a load of cars ie you are the 5th/6th buyer on a Saturday and laugh at my jokes Probably 2/3 a month get a small discount out of 40+ sales. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justina3 518 Posted January 15, 2018 14 hours ago, Dealer said: Sorry but this isn't the way for me, 2 customers today, both wanted substantial amounts off and 1 even wanted 2 tyres and a major service. Me to turned away two the weekend as there offers where wait for it first one £75 more than i paid for the car the second £150 less than i paid for it. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
andymc1973 199 Posted January 15, 2018 pisses me off, cheap car even cheaper people Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RH Trading 80 Posted January 15, 2018 Not used CAP for at least 3 years now, never accurate and adds more confusion than anything else, trade guides are always a guesstimate no matter who provides them. I look at how much I can sell the car for and knock off my costs and margin - that's my trade price, going off trade guides like CAP destroys my profit. throw them all in the bin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 11 Posted January 15, 2018 1 hour ago, RH Trading said: Not used CAP for at least 3 years now, never accurate and adds more confusion than anything else, trade guides are always a guesstimate no matter who provides them. I look at how much I can sell the car for and knock off my costs and margin - that's my trade price, going off trade guides like CAP destroys my profit. throw them all in the bin I agree this is the best way, but my point above remains in that when you look how much you can sell a car for, the prices on AT are just an advertised price - doesnt actually mean anyone will sell one at that rate 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RH Trading 80 Posted January 15, 2018 23 minutes ago, Jimbo said: I agree this is the best way, but my point above remains in that when you look how much you can sell a car for, the prices on AT are just an advertised price - doesnt actually mean anyone will sell one at that rate agree completely, you get an idea of the market for that car right now live, see todays prices and who (franchise/home trader/supermarket/non franchise) then decide your own realistic price. You wouldn't buy a car for £4k at BCA based on it being a CAP clean trade price, if there are 200 on AT priced at £4500. - I've done that in the past to my cost and sat on a car for 9 months 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites