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Car Values ! That old chestnut ! We all use various guides to value car s/ buy car s/sell cars ..but everyday its gets more and more challenging on not only what to buy m what to pay and then what to retail it for to make a workable margin. Find myself today question WHO is is really giving a TRUE VALUE of a car. Golf TDI BMT Match 5dr - 2015-15 -14000 miles VALUES AS Follows GG Trade £11970 Retail £13510 CAP Clean £12000 Retail £13695 Autotrader Retail £13759 In reality they are all very similar , a lot closer than many other cars I've checked On AT Prices start at £12395 / Loads at £12500 12/14000 miles - one owner On motors prices from £11999 with 17000 miles - One owner The low prices are mainly from car supermarkets / bid group - so does this mean they dictate what the retail market is ? I'm told auction prices are fetching cap clean + , don't forget the commission , transport etc etc , so how do we the independents compete ? As we all know customers who search these platforms will naturally do the ' price' checks but if they are selling at £1500/2000 less than the 'suggested' market price , surely these customers will travel and buy them ? ( I'm sure they will end up paying more with the bolt on's any way !) I'm sure the manufacturers of some these cars must be getting worried a Golf to depreciate circa 45% ?? ( 21500 new - trade circa 12000) ! Thoughts ?

Maybe a bit conversational but here goes ! I have no problem in everyone knowing who i am , name, dealer etc etc .. I just feel sometimes I see various posts and would be good to know more about the person/dealer/area /stock profile etc etc to give me better understanding about that dealer , I click on the name - , when it goes to profile nothing more ! So i'm none the wiser about who that person is or about their business ! If the full details were on there I'm sure we could possibly help each other more as we would understand each others businesses more , not only that but if I'd sold a car in a certain area had an issue with the car one of the trusted fellow dealers could help out - visa versa ! Just a thought ? what do YOU all think? umesh

It's that time of the year , the coveted Car Dealer Awards ... Having been there a few times and come back with an Award or two has been an amazing feeling , just thinking back brings a massive smile on my face and to meet so many other dealers, colleagues and friends .. this has to be 'THE EVENT OF THE YEAR ' .., For those who are thinking about or not thought about entering , Why not? Shout out about your business and WHY you should win .. deadline is looming , 31st October is the final day to get your entry in .. Details here to enter. https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/UsedCarAwards2016 Good Luck to everyone Umesh

Monthly results and your feedback greatly appreciated on behalf of Philip Nothard CAP-HPI This is the link to the link to the LinkedIn publication for last months. https://www.linkedin.com/shareArticle?url=https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/dealers-report-rise-demand-september-philip-nothard&title=Dealers%20report%20a%20rise%20in%20demand%20for%20September. New survey here: https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/6WMC6T9 Many Thanks Umesh PS The more we get the better feedback we ALL get.

Valuations Sure this topic has been brought up previously and no doubt it will be raised again BMW 1 Series SE Auto 3dr- £4040 factory options 21800 miles 2013/13. White / Black leather with £4040 factory options We all use various valuation tools , so I try to check its value on Autotrade-mail £14819 Glass's guide £14200 ( Strange as when Glass's DM and checked it came back at £13530) Cap Clean £12100 ( £11500 Average ) Now before I reveal what I THINK the market value is for this car I'd love to get your opinions ( Needs 2 wheel rufurbs thats all ) . What's Trade & Retail IF you were buying this for stock. Join in - don't be shy :).. After all no one is right or wrong - just look at the difference in opinions , or is it data ?

That time of the month if you could please done the quick survey for Philip Nothard - CAP ( Twitter if you don't already follow him - @PhilipN_cap_hpi ) He always shares the data with us .. https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/YWSSB69 Thanks in advance Umesh

That time of the month when our friend Philip Nothard Black Book Editor – Retail & Consumer Specialist needs just 2 Mins of your time for a quick survey and always he shares the market sentiments. It helps us all understand the market https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/QN88JBJ Thanks Umesh

All, There will be no doubt a great deal to understand and get our heads around; however: In the initial hours of today's result - what is your immediate 'gut' feeling in terms of it's impact on the new and used car market in the short and long term?

Think I've suggested this before but can't remember .. must be the grey matter ! Its not always easy to know who's who but let me pick on one person David Bilsborough as an example ( Hope you don't mind David ) David comments on a thread , if I want to know more about him I click on his name but it doesn't tell me anything more about him ? Website , location , tel No , email , twitter etc etc Would it not be useful if next to the name it showed this ? Umesh Samani www.autochange.co.uk Umesh@autochange.co.uk 01782 822 700 @specialistcars1 If all the details were shown then if David posted a comment I thought , you know what I'd like to have a personal conversation because it was interesting but more private than a forum , you simply pick the phone up or email at a click ? I FULLY understand some people need to keep their identity secret but .. just an idea ? thoughts ?

Every day we hear of another big dealer group buying up another business or investing millions building new sites for franchises , i.e Marshalls, Ridgeway , Swansway to name a few spending anything between £5/10 million on JLR sites ! What are your thoughts when you see these massive investments in the motor trade, especially when you hear of how little margins are left on new cars when customers are buying from the likes of carwow ? Plus the pressure to perform every quarterly with targets and pre-registrations , how /when does it become viable to invest these vast amounts ? Your thoughts ?

As reported in Motor Trader today: RAC Cars is dropping its free to list advertising model for dealers for its online classified. It is joining the the Motors.co.uk network in May to join Parkers, Sunday Times Driving, Motoring.co.uk and Carsite on the motors.co.uk network. Dealers will be able to access both brands’ consumers via a single Motors.co.uk stock feed and pay a monthly tenancy fee. RAC launched its free advertising model with claims that it would become market leader by close of 2015 with 500,000 cars listed, overtaking Auto Trader. There are currently 327,500 cars listed on the website. RAC Motoring Services managing director Robert Diamond said the joining Motors would give RAC Cars a broader customer base. “We wanted to engage with the whole of the UK car buyers and not just RAC customers,” he told Motor Trader. Dealers will sign up to the Motors, co.uk website for the first 90 days free of charge and after that pay a monthly tenancy fee to appear on Motors and other sites. Diamond said the free RAC model had failed to raise enough money “It [The free model] worked in that lots of dealers signed up and out stock volumes increased significantly. What was trickier was it did not raise enough revenues to support pay per click advertising,” he said. Now, together, the two businesses’ combined advertised stock increases to over 400,000 cars from more than 8,000 dealers, with audiences of 4.2m across the Motors.co.uk Network. A new RAC Cars website will be launched in May, with enhanced functionality and an improved user journey. RAC Cars promoted itself as “the motorist’s champion” which had “waived the fees for both private sellers and dealers in response to demands for an alternative to existing used car websites that charge high advertising rates.” Phill Jones, managing director of Motors.co.uk, said: “In RAC Cars, we have a partner that shares our passion for becoming a trusted matchmaker for automotive buyers and sellers. “This is great news for both car dealers and prospective buyers. It will provide dealers with access to a larger audience of in-market car buyers through a single relationship, while consumers will benefit from a greater choice of vehicles and the reassurance of RAC’s compelling consumer products. It also underlines Cox Automotive’s ongoing investment in Motors.co.uk to be the trusted advertising partner to the automotive industry.” As has been mentioned elsewhere, this was pushed out to the Trade as Free. For Life. So what happened? Other than the usual, I suspect, bit of corporate greed, the truth lies within the article: >>Diamond said the free RAC model had failed to raise enough money; “It [The free model] worked in that lots of dealers signed up and our stock volumes increased significantly. What was trickier was it did not raise enough revenues to support pay per click advertising,”<< No sh*t, Sherlock. Give it away for free and then wonder why the cash isn't rolling in. Cracking business model, that. >>"It also underlines Cox Automotive’s ongoing investment in Motors.co.uk to be the trusted advertising partner to the automotive industry.”<< No it doesn't. RAC told us it was free, and soon it won't be. Nothing trustworthy there, is there?

Just seen this article! We know it goes it everywhere in the country - but this just shows the extent to the number of cars being sold - It affects us all - hence legit dealers are losing business / profits ! A car dealer has been handed a 12 week suspended prison sentence after selling a potentially dangerous car while posing as a private seller. Ian Blinkhorne of Elm Road, Stratford, pleaded guilty to the charges against him at Nuneaton Magistrates following an investigation by Warwickshire County Council’s Trading Standards team. The 51-year-old sold the Ford Ka to a Leamington woman after he had advertised the vehicle for sale on Facebook, The Leamington Spa Courier reported. It later failed an MOT test and a Trading Standards’ vehicle examiner identified a number of faults which made the car unsafe to drive. Among the issues were faulty power steering, seized brakes, excessive corrosion to the driver’s seat mounting and failed suspension.

Well I guess it's this time of year that we all look back at the joys and triumphs , wondering where 2015 went ..it only seems 5 minutes since we were welcoming 2015 never mind waving goodbye to it. For me business has been challenging in 2015 compared to the 2 years of great results, so I have to think was it the market, was it me, the strategy ..we all do it and wonder what we did right /wrong or indifferent , so many things to take into account. In trying to see if I make next year absolutely awesome , I've been looking at Autotrader iControl system , lots of interesting data and a totally new way to sell cars, but one of the things that it shows is desirability of cars in areas, especially in my area, this would obviously help to sell cars faster and more profitable ! I also use motors.co.uk and asked for some data on my stock , now you'd think that would match AT desirability chart , wouldn't you ? Both give me different information , call me old fashioned but I've always worked on what I think I can sell from my business profitably , doesn't always work as its gut feeling , not actual science. Majority of the time gut feeling works ,but the odd few just do not work out , but then again if it was that easy everyone would be selling cars! Curious to know · How's your year been in comparisons to say last 2 ? · How do YOU buy cars ? desirability ? value? ?? whats on offer at the time? · will YOU Change the way you buy/sell cars in the coming year compared to 2015? · Do YOU Price your car at 'the price' as opposed to higher and then lower it if it doesn't sell ? · Do you have an overage policy or till it sells? · What ONE thing did you learn this year that you believe will significantly change/help you business next year ? Thanks for your input guys, wishing you all a happy new year and a very prosperous 2016.

I’ll throw this in and lets see what you guys think ! In reality ALL WE want is to advertise our cars for the cheapest method and get the best return /sales , but business constraints / open market /return on investment etc etc all dictate what can be done for what price. Also in reality WE Know Autotrader cannot bring down prices , So what can they do to make us all happy ! or how can they help us all ? magic wand – ideal situation- Fire away and lets see what ideas we can throw in , and just ,maybe just we can gain something from us all…. Thoughts Guys ?

When I started in sales way back in 1983 I was told this ... " Take as much profit out of a deal as you can when you sell a car , so when they return with any problems you simply smile and put them right !" How true is that ? If you don't make profit you can't look after them - , Doesn't matter how little you've made the customer always thinks you're still making thousands anyway .. so you might as well make thousands and if they have a problem .. smile, look after them .which in turns makes them happy, repeats, recommendations ! { Was trying to attach an image but failed, failed, failed )

'Under selling' How many of you are underselling your stock ? Strange question you may think? I've come across this again a few minutes ago with a customer I've been trying to source a car for, this time it's an Audi dealer selling a Q5 , BIG group , and bizarre how they must price their cars, I guess it's down to individual sites etc, however a quick look on their own website and prices all over the place. This particular car , Just arrived in to stock ( unit stocking suggests 07-09-15) No pictures on the website as yet , website says 40,000 miles - Actual Mileage 46,000m - Full spec not shown but has few more than what's mentioned ... advertised at £22000 - Customer told can have it for £20850 !! Big discount for a new car into stock for whatever reason ! now the numbers GG £19850 Retail £22650 ATM £19626 Retail £23550 CAP £18500 Retail £21900 One owner , full dealer history car , will come with full 12 Months Audi warranty , Now is it me or are they under selling the car ? Good colour Daytona grey / Black leather ! IS this why everyone is trying to compete with these deals ? or saying its quiet when you have a car similar but marked up at I believe higher price ? Has the dealer undervalued his own brand or do they know something we don't ? Any thoughts ?

I read with interest all the comments , mostly negative about Autotrader , their attitude, poor response, costs , and so forth , I'm ready to get my head shot off but here goes , some questions if I can get some truthful answers .. · Are you making more or less profit from car sales than you were last year? · Are you selling more or less cars than last year? · Are you getting more or less leads from Autotrader? · Why do YOU think you are getting less leads from AT? · Who or what type of business do YOU think is taking sales away from you? · Do you feel the used car market is very buoyant out there BUT you feel you are missing out on the piece of the action ? · IF you dropped advertising on AT -Would it affect your business ( Yes I know it will save you a fortune every month on bills ! } · HOW do you feel AT can help your business (without being able to lower the prices!) I'm with you guys the costs every month is crippling , but personally I've never had issues with attitude , or response from AT team, always been helpful and quick responses , yes sometimes I don't like the answers but that's business ! final thought , is that the 'used car' market is getting crowded with more and more dealers selling especially on line, non 'legit' sellers taking OUR business away or we're trying to compete on price = less profit PLUS cars being more complex costing us more to repair = less profit again. As mostly small independents we don't have 2nd/3rd avenue of income i,e servicing & repairs, added products so totally relying on 'car sales' , where as the bigger dealers/supermarkets etc get that extra top up. Are we looking at someone to blame? Don't forget the new legislation coming into force 1st October ! Just found my September 2003 -AT Contact £92.50 per week ! #GoodOldDays

'small independent dealers' Need some feedback from small independent dealers out there ! can you help ? Please send me an email with your contact details /weblink/Tel no etc. Thanks ,Appreciated . umesh@autochange.co.uk umesh

As we know, pre-registrations are without doubt topical at the minute, as to be expected with us at the 90-day stage since March and the new-plate on the horizon for many dealers. As the sentiment from this month's survey illustrates, we are in a very diverse market, with many dealers highlighting continual pressures on margins. In excess of half of those surveyed this month reported further compression. When you begin to investigate the route cause for this tightening, it’s very clear there isn’t a simple solution as costs are increasing, along with consumer expectations and direct costs, such as buyer's fees, advertising costs, etc. Another area not clearly identified here is where the chassis profit is increasingly becoming the main area for retained margins as controls, transparency increase through finance and add-on income. What is evidently noticeable is the positive improvement in July, with a retail market that generally could be referred to as steady or even healthy, with a favourable improvement in both physical footfall and retail and consumer demand. Dealer Survey Summary: - July sees a slight rise in those respondents reporting an increase in physical footfall from 15% in June to 21% in July; whilst those feeling it has declined dropped by -3% to 48%. In a period where over the preceding two, it’s felt tough. This is positive news for those experiencing a rise in this area. - Interestingly, unlike the physical footfall, the online activity hasn’t seen the equivalent level of respondents reporting an increase, with a drop from 29% in June to 23% this month. However, the remaining majority is reporting no noticeable change, as 40% report that it is about the same. The activities for both physical and online have without doubt eased since May this year. - The pressure on retained margins doesn’t appear to be easing soon, with once again 56% reporting they have been experiencing compression again since last month and 7% feeling they have seen some improvement. The question will be whether we will see an increase on the back of September in October, as we did in April? - From the dealers' perspective, the stock availability has remained much very similar as last month with 35% reporting they feel it’s improved; whereas 44% feel they’ve seen little or no change. The question remains in many conversations around whether the increased volumes are actually the ‘right’ stock and how much this is impacting on the continual pressures on retained margins. - Even with the changes in stock availability throughout the first half of the year, the quality of stock continues to remain reasonably stable. This is illustrated with as much as 73% of those surveyed reporting they have seen little or no noticeable change, and this has maintained above 50% throughout the year. The only increase was in March where 21% felt it had worsened; this will be an area to observe in September, and whether the new plate has any influence. - Those reporting that current trade values are reflective of the market have seen a slight change this month, with those reporting they feel they are too high has increased from 49% in June to 52%. However even more intriguing is that 7% felt they were actually too low. A comment that seems to resonate with those I speak to, is that ‘little and often’ is working with values, and they don’t want to see any extreme or reactive unnecessary movements of values. - Again, as we’ve seen with the physical footfall, this month retail and consumer demand, according to 24% of those surveyed, has seen an improvement. Similarly, those reporting it has worsening has dropped from 58% in June to 51% in July. As we approach a new plate month, could we experience an improvement close to that reported in March of 66%? - This month we asked which costs are impacting on retained margins, and is it directly related to increased costs? Interestingly only 33% felt this was the reason and as much as 51% didn’t feel that was the case. Whereas much of the sentiment was relating to costs, such as buyers fees, transport and on many dealers' agendas currently – advertising costs; others felt that the fact that footfall has been tougher and the overall market competitiveness are a key driver to retained margins. Generally a mix of ‘less traffic = reduce margins’, along with increased purchase, repair and re-marketing costs in a market where stock is reasonably easy to replace, and the retail buyers are given even more choice with ever more attractive new car offers. Notwithstanding the added pressures from the amplified volumes of pre-registration vehicles in the market, resulting in compression on nearly new prices and profit opportunities. The Market Survey – for Dealers, by Dealers Why has this survey been done? This market survey has been created in response to dealers hankering for a more holistic current sentiment of the questions they ask themselves daily, so they can understand the temperament of the wider market. Who is it for? Respondents cover a very diverse sector of the automotive industry, from the larger franchise groups, supermarkets, independents, single site owner-driven operations, through to auctions and remarketing. When is it undertaken? The survey is done monthly, within a very small open window. This ensures that the responses are market relevant and current. The data in this survey is for July 2015. Get involved! If you want to be involved in next month's Dealer Survey – for Dealers, by Dealers - then please contact CAP's Black Book Editor and Retail & Consumer Specialist, Philip Nothard. philip.nothard@cap.co.uk 07702 382 025 With over 27 years’ experience in the motor trade, Philip brings an informed eye to developing industry insight and market commentary. He joined CAP Automotive in 2010 as Retail & Consumer Black Book Editor, where he was responsible for analysing pricing data and interpreting strategic trends in retail, consumer and trade markets. A widely experienced and highly successful automotive specialist, he has a wealth of knowledge gained at the most senior levels whilst working for blue-chip businesses within this sector. His experience helps him to interpret trends and raw data into contextual and meaningful insight. Philip’s career includes managing dealerships for independents, supermarkets and large PLC groups. 07702 382 025 Philip.Nothard@cap.co.uk

I'm NOT Complaining at all... BUT What's happening to the motor trade , particularly the new car dealers [ Franchised ] , I don't know if it's the sales staff or the management , but I am very grateful as they are doing me a massive favour in obtaining some very, very nice cars. But I was under the impression that WE as dealers should be making it easy for the customer to buy a new car , easy changeover ALL in one easy transaction ? Let me get to the point ' Cash for cars' lot of dealers are moaning that they can't get their hand on nice, genuine cars, seems lots selling to 'cash for cars' type website here are a few extracts from my conversations with customers who I have bought cars from · Land Rover Dealer - to customer with a desirable BMW " You're better off selling it yourself , we won't give you the best price for your car , I suggest WBAC " · Mercedes Dealer to the customer with a Volvo " we will only sell your car to the trade i suggest you sell it yourself as you'll get more than my boss will give you " · Skoda Dealer " sell it to WBAC We don't really want it - A very desirable one owner Nissan , whilst i was collecting the Nissan his daughter came out and said would you be interested in the Audi A3 , I Said funnily enough I was just going to say I'd be interested when it comes for sale - She explained she was in the Audi dealer the day before having an MOT and asked how much against new/x-demo A3 - They told her " sell it yourself it's done too many miles and we wouldn't really give her the best price " - It's an A3 2.0TDI S Line Black Edition S-Tronic 2011- With 45000 miles FASH - · I can give various other examples , what is going on with the dealers ? As I've said I'm not complaining as I'm getting some amazing cars but seems the dealers expect the customers to do all the work and simply sit there order taking ! · any Thoughts ?

Future of the 'SMALLER' independents Looking and reading all the articles it seems the bigger are getting bigger , and the smaller are getting swallowed up by the big guys! or going bust! so what happens to us ? the smaller independents ! what is the future ? will be survive ? are we all just surviving and paying the bills ? Are we all making sufficient to keep re investing or just about hanging on ..for another year? Seems a very mixed picture out there, most who do admit the 'truth' are saying are going from month to month- year to year and cannot see a rosy future , it pays the bills ! So who can help -if anyone ? is it getting the right cars from the right place at the right price? is it the marketing platforms and that they could be bringing more leads /sales for less costs? is the small independent doomed or is there ways to change and its going to be the 'RISE' of the small independents ! Any thoughts ?

Lost in yesterdays budget announcements, is the changes in the car industry. 22. Road tax will be reformed and the money raised spent on the road network The road tax system will be revised to make it fairer and sustainable. From 2017, there will be a flat rate of £140 for most cars, except in the first year when tax will remain linked to the CO2 emissions that cars produce. Electric cars won’t pay any road tax at all and the most expensive cars will pay more. Existing cars won’t be affected – no one will pay more for a car that they already own. The money brought in from road tax in England will be spent on England’s roads from 2020. The government will extend the deadline for the first MOT of new cars and motorcycles from 3 years to 4 years. Interestingly, what could this cost the industry?Will it extend the renewal cycle for those consumers who change just before the MOT?Will Lease/CH companies look to increase their average contract period to 4-years?How much will it cost those who rely on MOT work for income?Does it actually cause a change to the price you would pay for a used car - 3-4 year old, as the existing MOT won't influence it?How did you view these changes?

Hi all, I've just started doing some research about car sales people and wondered if there was any sort of car dealer of the year competition or if its possible to find people who are considered the very best salesmen/women in the country. Would anyone want to suggest some names, or put themselves forward? I would like to speak to anyone really who has lots of ideas and opinions and passion about the trade, about cars, about selling. I can't say too much about who or what I am researching for at the moment but I can guarantee that I'm not trying to show the trade or any individuals in a negative light. I have just been tasked with finding some interesting personalities who live and breathe selling cars. Thanks for reading Graham

All, You may have noticed the 'odd' survey results being shared, and I would like to give you the opportunity to have your say and join in. I will post the results through Social Media and this forum once complete - with this being the halfway stage of the year; I will collate the year-to-date trends once June results are in. https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/HSDCC3P If you wish to be part of continuous market insight and sharing of data/intelligence, please feel free to email me philip.nothard@cap.co.uk Furthermore, if you wish to receive the previous survey results, please let me know. Many thanks in anticipation and hope you find the insight useful. Philip

Where is the motortrade / dealership going? Just wondering what thoughts everyone had on the future of retailing new & used cars. I was watching Alex Polizzi last week explaining to a couple who were running a kids fun cresh / cafe business and how if they didn't keep up with the changes and what customers wanted their business would end up like Blockbuster ! BUST! as they hadn't changed with the times with the introduction of Netflix , on demand movies etc. Any thoughts?